// #eevblog — 2020-02-03
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00:00:45 <T3sl4> your head is dirty from videos, certainly
00:00:57 <steve30> :p
00:04:23 <steve30> blame Halcyon for that; he's a bad influence
00:06:21 * T3sl4 pats the innocent steve30 on the head
00:13:36 <steve30> hmm, seems to play now i've just put a different tape in. I suspect a dirty head. I should order a head cleaner
00:25:52 <Lemon> I can't wait to receive my new toys
00:27:00 <Lemon> a triplett 630NS, a multavi 5, a micronta range doubler, a centrad 960 function generator, damn...
00:27:15 <steve30> sounds fun
00:27:29 <Lemon> all those expensive tools for that few is really impressive
00:27:42 <Lemon> I want to learn how to calibrate those analog meters !
00:40:54 <Lemon> hmmm so the dude with the current clamp keep reading 1 amp with his microwave, I suspect he's reading it wrong
00:41:02 <Lemon> thats easily done, those ranges are goofy sometimes
00:53:28 <coppice_> micronta is a name I haven't seen in a long time.
00:54:17 <Lemon> yeah ! its from radioshack/tandy I think
00:54:33 <Lemon> hmm so about that clamp meter (again), he's reading correctly
00:54:39 <coppice_> yeah. all their test equipment used that name
00:54:41 <Lemon> 1 amp on the 10amp range, from a working microwave over
00:54:59 <Lemon> is it badly calibrated ? dead ?
00:55:36 <Lemon> a microwave should show at least 5 amps, we use 220v main here
00:57:08 <coppice_> don't a lot of them work with half wave rectification?
00:59:11 <coppice_> you should try measuring a load you know is a simple one, like a heater element
01:03:45 <Lemon> well the thing is, someone is selling an analog clamp meter
01:03:51 <Lemon> but he doesnt know if it works properly
01:04:07 <Lemon> so I said, 'try to see how much your microwave use' as a simple test
01:04:12 <Lemon> and it reads 1 amp, which seems low
01:05:28 <coppice_> if the microwave is half wave (which most are) a clamp meter will give a very wrong answer
01:06:27 <Lemon> hmmm so for you, as long as that clamp meter shows something, theres good chances for it to work ?
01:06:40 <Lemon> https://www.leboncoin.fr/collection/1471882623.htm/
01:06:44 <Lemon> it looks in really nice condition
01:07:43 <coppice_> that doesn't mean its working properly, but its no clear indication of failure.
01:08:29 <Lemon> yeah I was just making a wild guess
01:08:59 <Lemon> I dont know if those are prone to failure or not
01:13:18 <Lemon> you'd buy it ? looking at its cosmetics, it seems it hasnt seen much usage
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01:22:44 <steve30> Lemon, I'd suggest to just get it and hope for the best.
01:23:09 <Lemon> yeah, but idk if its easily fixable
01:23:22 <Lemon> would a boiler give a good reading ?
01:23:41 <steve30> If it is mostly just a resistive heating element, yes
01:25:32 <Lemon> I asked him to try it with a boiler, im pretty sure its the easiest way. If it shows a few amps, I'll be fairly sure it works
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05:47:28 <Lemon> you know this feeling, when you miss an auction, but at the right last second the price skyrocket anyway
05:48:02 <Lemon> I feel better when its the case, than missing it by one euro or so
05:48:32 <rust_collector> I only know when you buy something for a pretty ok deal, then you find the same thing at half the price on a sale 2 days later
05:48:42 <Lemon> hey rustyyy
05:48:49 <Lemon> ho I do know it from time to time
05:48:55 <Lemon> guess what rust
05:49:08 <Lemon> I might have exaggerated today
05:49:13 <rust_collector> you bought a 3 ton reel of cable
05:49:26 <Lemon> damn you know me well...
05:49:30 <rust_collector> snip snip
05:49:36 <Lemon> haha no but I did bought some nice stuff !
05:49:48 <Lemon> first this morning, a peep answered positively for this
05:50:18 <Lemon> arf he deleted it but well
05:50:30 <Lemon> it was a pretty nice working multavi 5, all black for 16 euros with shipping
05:50:39 <Lemon> hartmann & braun multavi 5
05:50:54 <Lemon> then, something I have been following for a week
05:51:03 <Lemon> but didnt paid much attention, as I thought it would skyrocket
05:51:16 <Lemon> and as I rarely do, I bid
05:51:18 <Lemon> https://www.ebay.fr/itm/114085499677
05:51:21 <Lemon> and I got it :>
05:51:56 <rust_collector> well, what about the probes?
05:51:58 <Lemon> shipping do suck, but the overall price is more than reasonnable
05:52:08 <Lemon> which ones ?
05:52:19 <rust_collector> shipping to up here is 20.88 gbp, it says
05:52:30 <rust_collector> the probes for the triplett
05:52:31 <Lemon> It was around 20 euros total
05:52:42 <Lemon> haaa ho no worries for that, they are the same than the micronta
05:52:54 <Lemon> and theres some coming with the hartmann too
05:52:59 <rust_collector> ok
05:53:25 <Lemon> annnd im still debating to get this https://www.leboncoin.fr/messages/id/OJQvBdKmjbeYL0Jlx1szD8C7DlSpumUNuaP2SWttg-9HU3zRnPOXE7kmBsTryAyMbwmxYzOD71i68xy0gDNrDUE1WRLokOwWLqxCjcZk7FfXpmQpt7GzTLOz18a1_bsMNIdcvZZypGqi6RQePkHraJo9Sx7p46gRJZTPyty37cY5kbzHw8H8QsGJa273STmt
05:53:36 <Lemon> I wanted a nice current clamp as I have none, and came upon this one
05:53:48 <Lemon> but the dude cant tell me if it works properly, so I asked him to try on a boiler or something
05:53:48 <rust_collector> so, that is good then, put ebay and leboncoin in your hosts file, and go do something else for a while
05:54:16 <Lemon> yeah I will stop for a while now, too much things
05:54:36 <rust_collector> that link does not open for me.
05:54:43 <Lemon> https://www.leboncoin.fr/collection/1471882623.htm/
05:54:44 <Lemon> sorry
05:55:09 <rust_collector> heh, that is neat
05:55:25 <Lemon> he tried on his microwave over cable, and it showed 1 amp
05:55:30 <Lemon> but as someone said, its not a good way to test it
05:55:40 <Lemon> looking at its shape id say it works fine
05:55:53 <rust_collector> yeah, well, someone does not know what he is talking about
05:56:02 <Lemon> it seems in excellent condition, I cant see how it would be faulty
05:56:12 <rust_collector> nah, it is probably fine
05:56:28 <rust_collector> if it moves at all, it is probably working
05:56:29 <Lemon> I will take this one, then stop for a bit, unless theres some hyper low insane deal
05:56:39 <rust_collector> no you won't
05:56:41 <Lemon> I want to sell my laptop
05:56:45 <Lemon> ho I must honestly
05:56:58 <Lemon> I have almost all I need, I want to learn how to use them properly, calibrate them etc
05:57:07 <Lemon> and theres the two items mamalala wants to give me !
05:57:21 <Lemon> the day after he told me that, when waking up I thought it was a dream
05:57:57 <rust_collector> some dreams lasts longer than others. one of these days, you have to wake up and go to school
05:58:20 <Lemon> ha school, long time no see !
05:58:30 <Lemon> but im thinking more and more about taking an electronic school if I find one
05:58:46 <rust_collector> mmkay
05:59:36 <rust_collector> I should probably find some kind of clamp meter.
05:59:51 <Lemon> heh we tend to forget about them but its a nice thing to have
06:00:12 <rust_collector> I could use them quite a bit, diagnozing cars and crap
06:01:08 <rust_collector> on one side, I am trying to not work on cars, but I still do, so I should get a clamp meter, that I don't want
06:01:30 <Lemon> just buy a really nice one, you'll like it for its looks
06:01:46 <Lemon> the things I need but I want to avoid spending on it are pliers
06:01:53 <Lemon> needle nose pliers, bigger cutters etc
06:02:02 <rust_collector> Meh, as long as it works, I don't care.
06:02:02 <Lemon> but seeing how much I paid for my superknips, heh
06:02:28 <Lemon> I saw the knipex needle nose for 15 I think, that was somewhat acceptable
06:02:35 <Lemon> but 15+20+20 etc goes quick
06:02:41 <Lemon> seeing what 20 euros can get you
06:02:50 <rust_collector> good pliers are nice, especially needlenose ones that do not twist as much
06:03:04 <rust_collector> because you will end up twisting them
06:03:08 <Lemon> yeah im tired of using my leatherman
06:03:16 <Lemon> its too heavy and not made for fine things
06:03:22 <Lemon> well for electronics it should be fine
06:03:25 <Lemon> no much force implied
06:03:46 <rust_collector> I think I mentioned that, I tend to break the tip off the leatherman pliers
06:04:02 <Lemon> ho you are not alone trust me
06:04:19 <Lemon> it never happened to me yet but I twisted them a bit on various pairs
06:04:31 <Lemon> its not sturdy at all, only good for light work
06:04:43 <rust_collector> One side break off, then I cut the other one off to match, lol
06:05:09 <Lemon> then file them and bam, like new !
06:06:24 <Lemon> you know I try not to buy things for collection, I try to say 'this one will serve me for this, this one this etc'
06:06:43 <Lemon> like the triplett goes up to 6kv (I'll probably never use it like that but ho well I wanted it so badly I must admit it)
06:07:07 <Lemon> the micronta for fluctuations, the multavi because... well it was 16 euros, I might need it anyway
06:07:28 <Lemon> I started a collection haven't I
06:09:21 <rust_collector> yup
06:09:27 <rust_collector> good luck with that
06:09:36 <Lemon> I mussn't !
06:10:02 <Lemon> its all fun and games until you can't walk in your house anymore
06:10:15 <rust_collector> I think I might just buy a uni trend clamp meter. I will probably bounce that thing off a fan and shoot it thru a wall some day anyway
06:10:28 <Lemon> ho no please
06:10:31 <Lemon> not uni t
06:10:49 <rust_collector> I am pretty sure it will measure something
06:10:51 <Lemon> just look for used ones on ebay, you might find a pretty neat deal
06:11:58 <rust_collector> here is one for you: https://www.finn.no/bap/forsale/ad.html?finnkode=165960422
06:12:37 <Lemon> it looks pretty neat ! and im sure you can defend yourself with it
06:13:22 <Lemon> there was a prema 6000 at 75 euros
06:13:28 <Lemon> 6,5 digit multimeter
06:13:56 <Lemon> but the fluke mamalala wants to give me is so insane I might never have to get a new multimeter
06:15:17 <Lemon> its a 6,5 digit too, 0.004% dc accuracy after 1 year I think
06:15:28 Nick: T3sl41 is now known as T3sl4
06:15:32 <Lemon> thats more than I'll ever need
06:15:51 <Lemon> well I will surely find a way to use it :>
06:15:59 <rust_collector> yeah. I just need to know if I get 3 or 30 volts, I am ok
06:16:23 <Lemon> like measuring the shelf drift of a AA battery
06:17:19 <Lemon> no really in things I will actually have the need for it is an lcr metter but those arent that expensive, I found some decent ones for 50-60 euros on ebay, new
06:17:27 <Lemon> I dislike getting new chinese stuff, but theres no much choices
06:17:43 <Lemon> I have tons of salvaged capacitors, inductors etc to test
06:18:11 <Lemon> I already built the carlson leakage tester for capacitor, but its nice to also get their capacitance and esr (the cheapo tester I have isnt great at all)
06:18:53 <rust_collector> hmm, how much stuff goes into one of those?
06:19:09 <Lemon> the lcr meter ? or the carlson tester ?
06:19:17 <rust_collector> the carlson thing
06:20:01 <Lemon> ho its nothing, a few resistors, like one or two transistor, two leds, three ceramic caps and you are done
06:20:11 <rust_collector> hmm
06:20:15 <Lemon> it works fairly well
06:20:27 <Lemon> theres two positions, one for electrolytics and one for the rest
06:20:34 <Lemon> need 27v source
06:20:45 <rust_collector> yeah, I have seen him nag about how awesome it is
06:20:48 <Lemon> I used three 9v batteries but you can use any noise less dc source
06:20:57 <Lemon> he exaggerates a bit
06:21:03 <Lemon> theres nothing revolutionnary at all
06:21:05 <rust_collector> 27v... that is special
06:21:10 <Lemon> its clever, but nothing revolutionnary
06:21:14 <Lemon> well 3 9v cells
06:23:19 <Lemon> https://www.leboncoin.fr/outillage_materiaux_2nd_oeuvre/1114887337.htm/
06:23:24 <Lemon> that was the multavi I bought
06:23:26 <Lemon> if you can open it
06:24:10 <Lemon> damn my freaking trackball is acting up those days
06:24:19 <Lemon> lets see how much dead cells lies beneath it
06:24:29 <rust_collector> nah, it is a dead link now
06:24:54 <Lemon> https://img3.leboncoin.fr/ad-large/f2bf0131af05cd63e1f73112d93c8e2947078232.jpg
06:25:13 <Lemon> works ?
06:25:20 <rust_collector> yup
06:25:34 <Lemon> 10 + 6 for shipping, admit its a really nice deal
06:25:41 <Lemon> my first hartmann and braun ! sniff
06:28:46 <Lemon> https://www.leboncoin.fr/image_son/1679164468.htm/ this one looks strange
06:29:41 <rust_collector> well, you are french, so that should suit you fine....
06:29:51 <Lemon> :(
06:30:39 <Lemon> https://www.leboncoin.fr/collection/1702168539.htm/
06:40:55 <rust_collector> that is more like it
06:42:32 <Lemon> admit those things got a cool factor
06:42:58 <rust_collector> I still do not like the black "plastic"
06:44:22 <Lemon> but its bakelite ! its ultra sturdy
06:44:40 <Lemon> 5x10e16, thats how many zeros ?
06:44:45 <rust_collector> yeah, but it is still butt ugly
06:45:24 <Lemon> 10 millions of billions
06:45:54 <Lemon> 10 peta ohms damn
06:45:59 <Lemon> who would need that
06:46:54 <Lemon> I was talking about the keithley 617
06:47:01 <Lemon> I think thats the first one that got me in that game
06:47:06 <Lemon> I saw it and wow, I wanted one
06:47:17 <Lemon> then I started looking around, and ho look this one is nice.. and so on
06:47:29 <rust_collector> yeah, I noticed
06:47:47 <Lemon> it can measures down to 100 attoamps, up to 10 petaohms
06:47:54 <Lemon> thats really nuts for its age, and even then
06:48:21 <rust_collector> ohms used to be much larger than they are now, so they were easier to count
06:49:05 <Lemon> haha well
06:49:09 <Lemon> but still
06:49:12 <Lemon> peta ohms dude
06:49:37 <rust_collector> I am planning to stay happily ignorant
06:49:52 <Lemon> they are kinda expensive
06:49:57 <Lemon> 800-1k dollars
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07:26:40 <rust_collector> so, I got nothing done today. that is ok
07:52:16 <rust_collector> I guess I should see what this led strip does, or does not
07:53:58 <rust_collector> ok, it makes a lot of light. that is neat
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08:09:59 <rust_collector> ok, new desk lamp for me.
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08:59:06 <rust_collector> Ysjoelfir-mobil, give us some news!
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09:37:42 <MrMobodies> Hello
09:37:52 <rust_collector> hi mr
09:38:10 <MrMobodies> Is this chat log available online?
09:38:17 <MrMobodies> if not I wanted to ask a question
09:38:29 <MrMobodies> Someone tried to assault me at village pub
09:38:40 <MrMobodies> just by talking
09:38:53 <MrMobodies> I was told later he had brain cancer
09:38:59 <MrMobodies> and is loosing his memory
09:39:06 <MrMobodies> They restrained him
09:39:18 <rust_collector> I guess Ampera or T3sl4 has to answer about the log
09:39:31 <MrMobodies> he gets angry when I bring up historical stuff
09:39:47 <MrMobodies> I said if he assaults me I am pressing charges but
09:39:53 <MrMobodies> I am not there make enemies
09:40:11 <MrMobodies> I have got forgive tbey said he hasn't got long to live
09:40:22 <MrMobodies> he runs a computer shop that doesn't do well
09:40:49 <MrMobodies> he said to me "you think you know everything" I said I don't and i am not perfect I am just interested
09:41:03 <MrMobodies> he started out with the emotional abuse and i said well that's what you think
09:41:13 <MrMobodies> I met a few friends who are interested
09:41:29 <MrMobodies> and he went for me and they restrained I was holding his fists
09:41:43 <MrMobodies> he was weak, I could see fear, anger and confusion
09:41:52 * T3sl4 hugs MrMobodies
09:41:53 <MrMobodies> they told me to stay away
09:42:01 <MrMobodies> One said I was a threat
09:42:11 <MrMobodies> I am just a one band man, he owns a shop
09:42:37 <MrMobodies> apparently when I bring up stuff, he only remembers a little feels intimidated, to a friend wo knew for 12 years before his strokes
09:42:54 <MrMobodies> they don't use him anymore because he is not doing the work too good
09:43:09 <MrMobodies> some folks at the pub there said he did some good work but now
09:43:33 <MrMobodies> I just feel a little sad that's all
09:43:35 <MrMobodies> oops
09:43:50 <MrMobodies> they said he didn't mean what he said
09:44:04 <MrMobodies> and he don't want people to know he is terminally ill
09:44:20 <rust_collector> It is not fun when people pretty much lose their mind
09:45:04 <MrMobodies> he plays the slot machines and they give him back the money, if he wins he gives it to the staff. He likes to do that
09:45:42 <T3sl4> i guess not everyone can/knows how to die with grace and poise
09:45:56 <MrMobodies> I feel sorry for the man
09:45:59 <MrMobodies> at the same time
09:47:00 <MrMobodies> there are all stories about him around the village being useless as an technician, but I don't think that is the case.
09:47:16 <MrMobodies> it is the illness
09:48:05 <MrMobodies> I am not very good at handling situations like that... the person who explained it brought me a pint of lager
09:48:34 <MrMobodies> to calm me down a bit
09:48:36 <T3sl4> yeah, it's not a great situation for anyone
09:49:31 <MrMobodies> next time I'm there, I'd talk far away where it can't affect him and I'll be extra quiet.
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09:50:06 <MrMobodies> I suppose that is the only thing that enjoys going there and playing the slot machines
09:50:43 <MrMobodies> Please, someone say something. anything that'll make me feel better
09:51:22 <T3sl4> something
09:51:23 <T3sl4> :P
09:51:31 <MrMobodies> jokey
09:51:42 <rust_collector> sorry, but there is not much to say, it sucks when people get ill and stop being themselves. You sort of just have to deal with it
09:51:59 <MrMobodies> especially when you don't know their condition at first
09:52:43 <MrMobodies> I once met someone in Reading, he ran a business monitoring castles in Wales and MOD bases.
09:52:49 <MrMobodies> He had a heart attack in 2012
09:53:04 <MrMobodies> he had to take some tablets to drain his liver or we wouldn;t live
09:53:16 <MrMobodies> but the tablets were killing him slowly and couldn't see
09:53:23 <rust_collector> you do have the bright spot, that you do not have to live with this person.
09:53:32 <MrMobodies> oh yes
09:53:42 <MrMobodies> I do try to help out
09:54:34 <MrMobodies> this man in Reading was getting his wife to run the business and i helped out
09:54:50 <MrMobodies> he passed away in 2018 after the football highlights in his chair
09:55:16 <MrMobodies> days before I reported a router failed, overheating I believe at some RAF base
09:55:43 <MrMobodies> he was abusive attimes when things didn't go well
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09:59:00 <MrMobodies> I found this tune before christmas
09:59:03 <MrMobodies> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRmksUshjPk
09:59:12 <MrMobodies> I kind of liked it
10:01:28 <rust_collector> they had a thing for making good music back thern
10:09:14 <T3sl4> MrMobodies: https://i.imgur.com/QD6GLjs.jpg
10:13:35 <MrMobodies> just made some coffee
10:13:53 <MrMobodies> pretzels
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11:38:34 <MrMobodies> Is Ampera here?
11:38:40 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: LMAO! https://t.co/kcNQuFpJhR
11:40:30 <MrMobodies> I guess not present at the moment.
11:40:47 <MrMobodies> to do whether this will the chat log will be broadcasted
12:09:40 <Ampera> MrMobodies, I am now
12:09:55 <Ampera> The logs are not publicly available online, and probably never will be.
12:10:10 <Ampera> While I have a near complete log, I'd want to know why someone would need it before I release it.
12:29:30 <MrMobodies> thank you
12:30:13 <MrMobodies> This is the man who tried to attack me at the pub.
12:30:15 <MrMobodies> https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/company/09884122-aa-whittlesey-computers-ltd
12:30:39 <MrMobodies> I forgive him because he suffers from strokes and has not got long more to live
12:30:50 <MrMobodies> He has grown a beard, looks shorter than the one in the picture
12:30:56 <MrMobodies> and he is in a lot of debt
12:41:45 <MrMobodies> Got a spider web on one of the camera's triggering the motion detection.
13:00:18 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: Shonky product of the week: https://t.co/13ZOQ7xrE9 Earthing mats, for people...
13:14:23 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: I got a second shout out in The Art of Electronics X Chapters! Page 428 https://t.co/VJ1fSb6bJh
13:53:38 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: So I sell products on @amazon US. How TF can I copy/transfer/migrate those listings to @AmazonAustralia Doesn't seem possible?
14:45:49 <rust_collector> oooh, earthing mats. that sounds like a great idea
14:46:18 <rust_collector> good night
14:47:19 <DHess_US> I read "earthling mats"
14:47:29 <rust_collector> close enough
14:49:35 <DHess_US> Stupid weather, it is 42F out and I am burning up.
14:50:10 <rust_collector> 26 here. good times
14:50:50 <rust_collector> well, time to go to work. have fun
14:51:10 <DHess_US> Going to be 65F here tomorrow and nobody wants to see me take off more clothes.
16:23:36 Join: JoePublic ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
16:27:07 <JoePublic> With the current sale, I am trying to compare the US Amazon price with the AU + shipping price. Does the shipping (DHL) handle customs, or do I need to look that up myself?
16:27:36 <JoePublic> regarding multimeters that is
16:40:13 Quit: JoePublic ([email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
16:42:28 Join: JoePublic (JoePublicX`[email protected]) to #EEVblog
16:43:28 Quit: JoePublic (JoePublicX`[email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
16:44:32 Join: JoePublic ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
16:44:57 <Ampera> JoePublic, I'm afraid that's a question better answered by dave himself.
16:45:07 <Ampera> You should email him, or make a new thread on the forums
16:47:53 <JoePublic> Ah. Will do.
16:48:53 Quit: JoePublic ([email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
17:11:23 Join: JoePublic ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
17:12:44 Part: JoePublic ([email protected]) from #EEVblog
17:14:45 Join: hsn93 ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
17:35:04 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Retweet: Richard Stephenson: After two days of no smoke, here we go again. The fire front is still 12km away but it looks closer. A windshift towards the station is expected in a couple of hours. Still no threat but it makes for a good photo. https://t.co/3TRkit4L1y
17:42:07 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: If you are banking on companies in China returning to normal on Feb 10th as has been often stated, I think you're going to come-a-gutsa. The #coronavirus could be the 737MAX of the virus world.
18:05:16 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: Reminder, you can earn LBC credits just by watching my videos here: http//www.eevblog.tv And there are no ads.
18:20:05 <Halcyon> Evening everyone
18:25:34 Nick: steve30000 is now known as steve30
18:25:36 * Halcyon swats at Ampera
18:25:39 <steve30> hi Halcyon
18:26:19 <Halcyon> Hey Steve :)
18:26:22 <Halcyon> How are you?
18:26:29 <steve30> i just got up
18:26:53 <Halcyon> Aww
18:26:56 <Halcyon> I just got home from work
18:27:25 <steve30> I'm going to the gym later
18:28:04 <Halcyon> Nice :)
18:29:41 <hsn93> hey
18:30:18 <Halcyon> Hey hsn93
18:30:23 <hsn93> h r u ?
18:35:03 <Halcyon> Not too bad mate, you?
18:35:14 Quit: Ysjoelfir-mobil ([email protected]) EOF from client
18:35:17 Join: Ysjoelfir-mobil_ ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
18:49:21 * steve30 hugs Halcyon
18:51:34 Join: DogWomble ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
18:51:34 Mode: (by ChanOP) +o DogWomble
18:55:07 <Halcyon> :) Aww
18:55:36 <steve30> I was daydreaming about cuddly boys earlier
18:58:05 <Halcyon> Oh yes? :P
18:58:13 <Halcyon> Like the cat man off YouTube?
18:59:12 <steve30> nah
19:03:25 <Ampera> hi Halcyon
19:10:57 <Halcyon> How are you Ampera?
19:11:04 <Ampera> bad
19:11:06 <Ampera> very bad
19:11:09 <Halcyon> Why bad?
19:11:16 <Ampera> I have to wake up in under 3 hours.
19:11:22 <Ampera> and then get ready to go to work
19:11:32 <Halcyon> Oh you start your new job today :)
19:11:37 <Ampera> yes.
19:11:56 <Ampera> speaking of which, do you still have and use your dual LGA 1366 board?
19:13:05 <Halcyon> The only dual CPU board I have is in a HP Server
19:13:08 <Halcyon> And it's a custom board
19:13:16 <Ampera> it used to be your desktop machine
19:13:22 <Halcyon> Yes, it's a HP Server
19:13:51 <Ampera> was curious, as I'm contemplating purchasing and implementing a dual LGA 1366 machine.
19:13:54 <Halcyon> ML350 G6
19:14:31 <Halcyon> You would be better off finding something local, the cost to ship it would be astronomical
19:14:38 <Halcyon> It weighs about 30+ KG
19:14:51 <Ampera> The issue is that finding a power supply and case solution is my current problem,
19:15:24 <Halcyon> Even if I sent you the board, it wouldn't fit in a normal case nor use a normal ATX style PSU
19:15:28 <Ampera> Everything I'm looking at is around 300 bucks for something reasonable, since the board is obviously E-ATX, and a power supply that has the connectors and power to drive the machine is insane.
19:15:42 <Ampera> keep in mind I'm just evaluating options
19:16:06 <Ampera> I might just say fuck it and look at complete servers on ebay
19:16:24 <Ampera> as they can be quite cheap, and for a Westmere EP grade system, all the fixings, I'll be spending much less
19:17:51 <Ampera> I think I might actually not be out of my mind to implement a server cluster...
19:18:08 <Halcyon> Ex enterprise gear sells for cheap. It's everywhere
19:18:15 <Halcyon> Governments and companies just get rid of it
19:19:08 <Ampera> so here's the thing, I'm planning on aggregating me and my dad's server infrastructure
19:19:16 <Ampera> and by aggregating, I mean I'll buy some gear and he'll use it.
19:19:30 <Ampera> since, through an astronomical turn of events, I have money and he doesn't
19:20:01 <Ampera> Halcyon, https://www.ebay.com/itm/153611715073 something in the ballpark of this
19:20:19 <Halcyon> Yep, hit up the auctions. ebay is a bit meh for that sort of thing, usually it's the resellers re-listing their stuff on ebay
19:20:27 <Halcyon> Find a proper auction house
19:20:37 <Ampera> I'll go hunting at some point
19:20:48 <Halcyon> Yep, you can buy that kind of gear by the pallet load, even here
19:21:07 <Ampera> The idea I think now is to get one high performance central server, and have two storage servers off to the side
19:21:27 <Ampera> I'll see if I can find cheap 10GbE gear, then I can link stuff together using direct attach copper
19:21:29 <Halcyon> Yep, that's the way to do it. More or less the set up I have here
19:21:41 <Halcyon> DAC cables are cheap
19:21:49 * steve30 meows at Halcyon in the hope of getting a hip massage
19:21:53 <Ampera> The NICs are not, but I'll look around for surplus SFP+ stuff
19:21:56 <Halcyon> A few hundred bucks will get you a few decent 10 Gig NICs
19:22:07 <Ampera> yeah that's what I'm afraid of.
19:22:11 * Halcyon puts the cat outside
19:22:29 <Halcyon> 10 Gig hasn't quite come down in price to be what I would call "cheap" but it's "affordable"
19:22:33 <Ampera> I could also just go crazy, buy some 4x GbE NICs and have a spaghetti party.
19:22:52 <Halcyon> You could, but then you run into the limitations of link aggregation
19:23:23 <Ampera> Regardless, I want to keep the whole budget for this project within around a thousand bucks or so.
19:23:35 <Halcyon> I think that's certainly very doable
19:23:40 <Halcyon> The disks will be the most expensive part
19:23:44 <Ampera> Nope.
19:23:53 <Ampera> I can get 4TB Hitachi refurbs for 60 bucks a pop.
19:23:57 <Ampera> That's not the expensive part.
19:25:09 * steve30 hisses at Halcyon
19:25:12 <Halcyon> If they are HGST Ultrastar's, yeh OK, reasonable enough price
19:25:17 <Halcyon> But not for new consumer disks
19:25:24 <Ampera> That's exactly what they are.
19:25:27 <damian> i dont think so!
19:26:00 <Halcyon> I'm buying brand new HGST/WD Ultrastar disks for AUD$302 each
19:26:05 <Halcyon> (4TB)
19:26:11 <Ampera> https://www.newegg.com/p/1Z4-001J-00883?Item=9SIA5ADAZD5832&quicklink=true
19:26:33 <Ampera> I've used these refurbs (the 2TB versions) for years, they were my first high capacity drives.
19:26:48 <Ampera> My original 2TB drive is still running strong, and the other two are doing fine as well for a while too.
19:27:00 <Halcyon> Yep, they are decently priced for sure, if you don't mind foregoing the manufacturer warranty
19:27:06 <Halcyon> But if they seller offer returns, then *shrug*
19:27:17 <Ampera> They offer reseller warranty
19:27:25 <Ampera> but for 60 bucks, it's almost throwaway cheap
19:27:33 <Halcyon> I have the 2TB drives in my server now. Still going after over 8 years. But that was before WD bought them
19:27:43 <Halcyon> Haven't bought them since
19:27:44 <damian> why such big hardware for home?
19:27:55 <Ampera> BECAUSE I WANT IT YOU SALMON
19:28:01 Join: Lemon ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
19:28:07 <Lemon> waddup
19:28:12 <Ampera> MACKEREL
19:28:16 <Halcyon> I have a 10TB array at home, it's barely enough
19:28:31 <Halcyon> I need at least 50% that on the next upgrade
19:28:37 <Halcyon> Sorry 150%
19:28:45 <Ampera> I also need to keep in mind my own PC's upgrading, but that can remain for a bit.
19:28:46 <damian> i don't disagree with more disk, but why 4TB DC disks instead of something cheaper and bigger
19:28:53 <Halcyon> But, I'm holding out for SSDs to become cheaper
19:28:57 <Ampera> I think over the coming months I'm going to do a gradual hardware upgrade rollout.
19:29:06 <Ampera> damian, suggestions are welcome.
19:29:32 <Halcyon> damian: Yep, I would just buy consumer disks, use ZFS with 2 or more disk redundancy
19:29:41 <Ampera> These are cheaper than consumer.
19:29:51 <damian> i run 10tb ironwolf's at home and they are good, 8tb for $350au
19:29:53 <Halcyon> No way
19:30:02 <damian> $50 more per disk and you get double the disk space
19:30:36 <Ampera> WD Blues are 88 USD Seagate Constellations are 65 USD
19:30:40 <Ampera> 4TB brand new consumer grade
19:31:33 <Halcyon> If you're planning a proper hardware RAID controller, then absolutely get the Ultrastar's
19:31:44 <Ampera> This will likely all be ZFS.
19:31:50 <Halcyon> But for something like ZFS, just get the cheapest brand name disks you can find
19:31:59 <Ampera> These are the cheapest brand name disks I can find.
19:32:00 <damian> why not with raid?
19:32:16 <Ampera> ZFS is easier to manage, and doesn't have some of the issues hardware RAID has
19:32:23 <Halcyon> Damian: Mainly due to TLER. Consumer drives (can) randomly drop out of the array
19:32:25 <Ampera> like being up shit's creek if the controller dies.
19:32:34 <Halcyon> The drive itself tries to do error correction, rather than the controller
19:32:45 <Halcyon> I went through both Seagate and WD drives before I cracked the shits
19:33:29 <Ampera> They have 6TB Ultrastars for 100 USD
19:33:34 <Halcyon> Nice
19:33:43 <damian> i've had a number of backup servers over my IT career run barracudas and not have any issues with the raid
19:33:45 <Ampera> 8TB for 160
19:33:56 <Halcyon> I'll hold out for SSD
19:33:57 <damian> just not an issue i've ever run into
19:34:07 <damian> well, i have .. on a hp microserver, but that was because the raid not really raid :P
19:34:25 <Halcyon> Nope :P
19:34:25 <Ampera> ZFS is nice because I am a 100% FreeBSD environment as far as servers are concerned.
19:34:30 <Ampera> So I have native support, and it's easy to manage.
19:35:11 <Halcyon> I mean a proper LSI card (or similar)
19:35:33 <Halcyon> Yep, ZFS is nice, offers more features than a hardware RAID card does
19:35:44 <Ampera> I also don't have to pay for ZFS, whereas a real RAID card I do.
19:35:50 <Halcyon> *nod*
19:35:59 <Ampera> My storage servers are going to end up being HP workstation gear I've conned into working.
19:36:38 <Ampera> I literally just spent 45 bucks on one, which comes with 4GB of DDR3, one throwaway Xeon, a Xeon X5650, and a motherboard.
19:41:01 <Halcyon> Anyway damian, how are you?
19:42:23 <Ampera> just came across this person: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariya_Oktyabrskaya
19:43:55 <Ampera> proper madlad
19:44:41 <damian> tired, always tired! haha
19:44:43 <damian> but otherwise good
19:44:45 <damian> what about you guys
19:44:57 <Halcyon> Same
19:45:02 <Ampera> damian, I am on an entire other level of tired.
19:45:08 <Ampera> Today is my first day of work
19:45:11 <Ampera> and it is 3:45
19:45:13 <Ampera> and I haven't slept
19:45:15 <Ampera> because I couldn't
19:45:31 <Ampera> hello mr. caffeine pill
19:53:21 <steve30> I should go out
19:53:24 <steve30> back later
19:57:54 <Ampera> back to working on my G5
20:05:45 * Ampera throws an edison base fuse at Halcyon
20:07:07 <Halcyon> Oww, solid
20:08:52 * Ampera touches Halcyon with something else that's solid
20:09:03 <Halcyon> A rod?
20:09:32 <Ampera> you could say that
20:11:06 * Ampera throws a sixel at Halcyon
20:13:58 * Halcyon throws Jerry at Ampera - Attack!
20:14:04 <Halcyon> He'll flap you
20:14:22 * Ampera hugs Jerry
20:14:38 <Ampera> birb
20:14:42 <Halcyon> He is getting cheek and neck scratches at the moment
20:15:32 <Lemon> what do we talk about today ?
20:16:10 <Ampera> Immense, crippling, existential depression and pain.
20:16:24 <Halcyon> Or food?
20:16:28 <Lemon> ho nice, finally a subject I know about !
20:17:05 * Ampera throws a 1GB stick of DDR400 at Halcyon
20:17:19 <Halcyon> They have pointy edges
20:17:43 <Ampera> I have pointy edges too
20:17:55 <Halcyon> Pfft where?
20:17:57 <Lemon> I have edges
20:17:58 <Ampera> I'm listening to the classic Australian song, five hundred miles.
20:19:27 <Ampera> my macintosh was back in the 70's
20:22:43 <Halcyon> Five Hundred Miles?
20:22:45 <Halcyon> The Proclaimers?
20:22:53 <Ampera> No, they're not australian you tuna
20:22:57 <Halcyon> No shit
20:23:20 <Halcyon> But you're a bit retarded so I was making sure you knew
20:24:11 <Ampera> er
20:24:14 <Ampera> weechat ate shit
20:24:20 <Halcyon> Surprise
20:24:41 <Ampera> all I'm trying to do is copy/paste a link
20:24:52 <Ampera> er
20:25:15 <Ampera> am I spamming chat and I just don't know it
20:25:34 <Ampera> whenever I paste something the cursor gets unhinged
20:25:35 <Ampera> brb
20:25:49 <Ampera> quit
20:26:33 <Ampera> no matter what I paste it does that
20:27:08 <Halcyon> Hey Ampera, how much can I pay you to rename 935 files?
20:27:22 <Halcyon> Each one needs to be opened to view the title page then renamed
20:27:42 <Ampera> if I had time I'd do it for free
20:27:46 <Ampera> because that sounds like my idea of a good time
20:28:00 <Halcyon> I figured, that's why I asked :P
20:28:23 <Lemon> I want a vtvm !
20:28:24 <Ampera> how about this, you upload it to me and I'll get to it in my spare time
20:28:28 <Ampera> I presume it doesn't need to be done ASAP
20:28:35 <Halcyon> You might actually appreciate them too
20:28:40 <Halcyon> Nope, no rush
20:28:44 <Halcyon> Where can I upload them?
20:29:09 <Ampera> idk if you still have ssh access into my server
20:29:15 <Ampera> from when you uploaded those videos
20:29:25 <Ampera> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5J31DPRRRVI
20:29:30 <Ampera> that's what I Was trying to paste.
20:29:57 <Ampera> not really an australian classic, I just wanted to see if you'd fall for the bait
20:30:26 <Ampera> if you don't have the key, I have it
20:31:19 <Halcyon> What's the server addy and my username?
20:34:30 <Halcyon> SFTP ?
20:34:50 <Halcyon> It's timing out
20:35:30 <Halcyon> Status: Resolving address of amperaa.net
20:35:31 <Halcyon> Status: Connecting to [2001:470:8a68::dead:beef]:3120...
20:35:31 <Halcyon> Error: Connection timed out after 20 seconds of inactivity
20:35:31 <Halcyon> Error: Could not connect to server
20:35:38 <Ampera> ah, you're resolving to ipv6
20:35:42 <Ampera> let me let you through the firewall, standby
20:36:30 <Ampera> Halcyon, try again
20:36:42 <Halcyon> Status: Connection established, waiting for welcome message...
20:36:42 <Halcyon> Response: SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.8 FreeBSD-20180909
20:36:42 <Halcyon> Error: Cannot establish FTP connection to an SFTP server. Please select proper protocol.
20:36:42 <Halcyon> Error: Critical error: Could not connect to server
20:36:50 <Halcyon> Oh wait
20:36:55 <Ampera> ya moron
20:37:08 <Halcyon> I had SFTP but it deleted it
20:37:13 <Ampera> deleted it?
20:37:17 <Ampera> install openssh
20:37:18 <Halcyon> Error: Disconnected: No supported authentication methods available (server sent: publickey)
20:37:18 <Halcyon> Error: Could not connect to server
20:37:24 <Ampera> yeah then you need the key
20:37:26 <Ampera> let me send that to you
20:37:33 <Halcyon> I'm sure I've used Filezilla before to do this?
20:38:17 <Ampera> obviously not
20:38:26 <Ampera> otherwise you'd still have the key
20:38:31 <Ampera> I invalidated it already anyways
20:38:35 <Halcyon> Unless you had me set up with a password before?
20:38:37 <Ampera> since I can't remember if it had a password
20:38:39 <Ampera> nope
20:38:45 <Halcyon> *shrug*
20:38:46 <Ampera> passwords are chroot only, and readonly
20:39:41 <Halcyon> I'll save it as a site in FileZilla so I don't have to go through this every time
20:39:55 <Halcyon> DCC should work on IRC now because IPv6
20:40:00 <Halcyon> You can send me the key
20:40:18 <Halcyon> Or Discord
20:40:33 <Ampera> lol DCC, like I know how to do that via weechat
20:40:43 <Ampera> I sent you the key via discord and the password via IRC
20:40:49 Quit: Lemon ([email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
20:42:13 Join: Lemon ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
20:42:29 <Lemon> ho hey peeps, someone can explain to me what is the tracking feature on my dual ouput lab psu ?
21:05:25 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Retweet: Hey @nascom1 YOUR DISH IS ON FIRE! Let me guess, someone turned on the 400kW TX by mistake... :Which was quoting: CanberraDSN: Update (3 Feb): With the roads leading out to the station remaining closed, unfortunately our visitor centre and @DeepSpaceCafe1 also remain closed until further notice. Lots of smoke from the fires in the distance but the station is not under threat. https://t.co/ish9h3hSuO
21:26:22 <K> hello
21:27:05 <Lemon> hey
21:43:25 <Lemon> rust_collector you there bud ?
21:52:23 <Lemon> ok so someone is selling a keithley 610B near my area
21:52:31 <Lemon> its like, unbelievable
21:52:36 <Lemon> those things are ultra rare and expensive
21:53:05 <Lemon> it can measure current down to femto amps, ohms up to 100 TeraOhms, coulomb up to 10e12 etc
21:53:16 <Lemon> it seems in great shape and he wants 85 euros for it
21:55:18 Join: hsn993 ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
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22:01:21 <K> whoopsies, look slike forum went down
22:08:44 <Lemon> gahhh im so tempted by that 610B
22:08:56 <Lemon> but I keep reading that those triaxial cables/connectors cost a lot
22:09:18 <Lemon> also this thing is so sensitive that farting in the same room with make the needle move
22:09:53 Quit: hsn993 ([email protected]) Ping timeout: 121 seconds
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23:04:19 Join: hsn993 ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
23:30:13 <hsn993> isnt it better to clamp surges between (rj45 <-> transformer) instead of (transformer <-> phy) ??
23:30:16 <hsn993> https://snipboard.io/ESyeTB.jpg
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23:35:23 Quit: Guest|99383 ([email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
23:44:59 <T3sl4> hsn993: there can be voltage between rx/tx which that would shunt
23:45:16 <T3sl4> well, on the RJ side that is
23:46:18 <T3sl4> i typically don't bother putting ESD diodes on ethernet, doesn't seem to need it
23:47:18 <hsn993> why does esd get filter from the transformer?
23:49:12 <T3sl4> not so much filtered as isolated
23:49:19 <hsn993> voltage between rx/tx that would shunt.. in case its not a POE.. would that be a problem ?
23:49:33 <T3sl4> also, differential mode will saturate the core pretty quickly, so the pulse duration is short
23:50:43 <T3sl4> non-PoE, voltage would be surges, which will CM-DM conv, and upset some bits in the data lines
23:50:55 <T3sl4> which for as error tolerant as eth is, that should still be fine
23:51:22 <hsn993> so in case its non-PoE == its better to clamp from connector side..
23:51:59 <hsn993> although u find modular connectors that already has transformers = better i guess :D
23:53:13 <coppice_> with PoE you have to worry about discharges from pointy pointy birds
23:53:43 <T3sl4> quoth the raven: packet loss
23:54:24 <hsn993> discharges from birds !!!?
23:54:34 <hsn993> what happens ? :>
23:55:19 <T3sl4> then, the beating of the telltale power supply
23:55:50 <T3sl4> hsn993: not sure how familiar you are with classic english literature, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edgar_Allan_Poe
23:56:15 <hsn993> :D aaaa
23:56:31 <hsn993> i just googled all keywords about poE and birds
23:56:39 <hsn993> and surges
23:58:07 <hsn993> T3sl4 .. so u only need to worry about (transformer isolation) ?
23:58:49 <hsn993> and that its core is not (big) so its running on the saturation margin ?
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