#d&d - 2013-03-07 - AustNet Archive Project

// #d&d — 2013-03-07

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13:24 <Mekkis> do you understand netmasks, S711 
22:49 <S711> No.
31:40 <Mekkis> do you understand bitwise operations?
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25:49 <Mekkis> !spell awaken
25:51 <diebot> Mekkis, AWAKEN transmutation ([]) druid 5 24 hours Range: touch animal or tree touched Comp: V, S, M (herbs and oils worth 2,000 gp), DF Duration: instantaneous Save: Will negates SR:yes
25:51 <diebot> The description is too long to send over IRC. View http://nl.ti4200.info/vpsirc/spells/awaken.html
26:04 <Avatar> awaken is banned isn't it
10:19 <Avatar> I've got no idea what to take for my other 2nd level bard spell on my low-save DC caster
10:36 <Avatar> invisibility is feeling like a decent choice, but I feel silly when I've already got vanish
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32:27 <Steven> sorry i keep forgetting i upped my dex, i do +13 damage now.
33:14 <Steven> 4d12+60 damage on a BBEG is a damn good chunk of his life... all that before bane as well.
33:29 <Mekkis> I know
33:36 <Mekkis> hey Brunius!
33:40 <Mekkis> run a 7-11 for us!
33:53 <Steven> so if you name bullet while baning, 4d12+68+2d6, followed by two more shots.
34:08 <Mekkis> hmmm
34:17 <Mekkis> what are the rules for non-gunslingers using guns?
34:24 <wrothmonk> they cant
34:34 <Steven> you take the non proficiency bonus of -4
34:49 <wrothmonk> no I think its "you can't" period
34:53 <wrothmonk> let me check again
35:23 <Mekkis> No character may purchase a firearm unless she possesses the Gunsmithing feat and firearms are never considered Always Available; a character must possess enough Fame to purchase any firearm not found on a Chronicle sheet or granted by a class feature
35:52 <Steven> anyone can use a gun, but only gunslingers can purchase guns.
35:59 <Steven> so if i wanted to i could hand my musket off to someone else.
36:31 <Steven> they could fire it, and then spend a full round action to reload it.
36:32 <Mekkis> is says that you need the Gunsmithing feat to buy a gun
36:56 <Steven> which you cant take gunsmithing unless you are a gunslinger.
37:03 <Mekkis> !feat gunsmithing
37:04 <diebot> Mekkis, GUNSMITHING [] You know the secrets of repairing and restoring firearms.  Benefit: If you have access to a gunsmith's kit, you can create and restore firearms, craft bullets, and mix black powder for all types of firearms. You do not need to make a Craft check to create firearms and ammunition or to restore firearms. Crafting Firearms: You
37:05 <diebot> can craft any early firearm for a cost in raw materials equal to half the price of the firearm. At your GM's discretion, you can craft advanced firearms for a cost in raw materials equal to half the price of the firearm. Crafting a firearm in this way takes 1 day of work for every 1,000 gp of the firearm's price (minimum 1 day).  Crafting
37:05 <diebot> Ammunition: You can craft bullets, pellets, and black powder for a cost in raw materials equal to 10% of the price. If you have at least 1 rank in Craft (alchemy), you can craft alchemical cartridges for a cost in raw materials equal to half the price of the cartridge. At your GM's discretion, you can craft metal cartridges for a cost in raw
37:05 <diebot> materials equal to half the cost of the cartridge. Crafting bullets, black powder, or cartridges takes 1 day of work for every 1,000 gp of ammunition (minimum 1 day). Restoring a Broken Firearm: Each day, with an hour's worth of work, you can use this feat to repair a single firearm with the broken condition. You can take time during a rest period
37:05 <diebot> to restore a broken firearm with this feat. Special: If you are a gunslinger, this feat grants the following additional benefit. You can use this feat to repair and restore your initial, battered weapon. It costs 300 gp and 1 day of work to upgrade it to a masterwork firearm of its type.
37:05 <diebot> Benefit:  Source: UC
37:14 <Steven> its not a rule, its a policy.
37:24 <Mekkis> it's not on Additional Resources
38:19 <Steven> hey if you can find a work around let me know mekkis, i'll be glad to tell brock about it so he can close it.
38:43 <Mekkis> Steven, I'm not seeing anywhere where it says that you need to be a gunslinger to buy a gun
38:48 <Mekkis> that's what I'm getting at
38:58 <Mekkis> or is it somewhere other than Additional Resources?
39:12 <wrothmonk> well it looked like if you have exotic weapon proficiency and the gunsmithing feat you can get a gun with fame.
39:29 <wrothmonk> and use it
39:42 <Mekkis> and if that's a "loophole" then yes, I think it should be looked at.
41:20 <Mekkis> I should get Defunct a GUN!
41:35 <wrothmonk> I should buy rumil a gun
41:46 <Mekkis> yeah... and imp, with a GUN
41:47 <wrothmonk> if they change it I may get a free rebuild :D
41:52 <Mekkis> :)
42:16 <wrothmonk> except… I'm going to have a hard time getting the feats.
42:30 <Mekkis> you don't need the Exotic Weapon Proficiency
42:37 <wrothmonk> good point
43:17 <wrothmonk> I believe I have the fame and the cash
43:30 <Steven> you cant buy a gun.
43:40 <Steven> The first place guns were introduced was the inner sea world guide
43:41 <Mekkis> where does it say that/
43:43 <Mekkis> ?
43:53 <Steven>  Equipment: all weapons, armor, and adventuring gear on pages 290–293 with the following restriction: only gunslingers may purchase firearms except cannons, which are not available to anyone;
44:24 <wrothmonk> where is that?
45:42 <wrothmonk> inner sea world guide
46:06 <Steven> http://paizo.com/products/btpy8ief/discuss?Pathfinder-Campaign-Setting-The-Inner-Sea-World-Guide#tabs
46:12 <Mekkis> so, sure
46:23 <Mekkis> you can get a gun, if you buy it out of UE
46:26 <Mekkis> umm
46:26 <Mekkis> UC
46:37 <wrothmonk> yeah looks like it.
46:47 <wrothmonk> since it is under a separate book
47:03 <Mekkis> better get one for Rumil now
47:06 <Mekkis> :P
47:08 <wrothmonk> yes.
47:16 <Mekkis> I want to get one for Defunct :)
47:41 <Steven> no, thats not how it works, they dont list redudancies if they can help it in the Additional resource page
47:55 <Steven> otherwise the document would be about 4 times as long.
48:37 <Mekkis> then why is Rich Parents disallowed twice?
49:01 <Steven> I dunno, message brock about it.
49:10 <wrothmonk> looks like I got enough fame..
49:21 <wrothmonk> now then how to get the feat...
49:37 <Mekkis> I'm having a hard enough time convincing a fellow player that he can't play a paladin of Calistra...
50:05 <Mekkis> there's no way they'd buy the "because it's not allowed from ISWG, it's not allowed from UC" stuff
50:18 <Mekkis> wrothmonk, level of fighter?
50:26 <wrothmonk> I don't want to do that.
50:34 <wrothmonk> It could end up just being a refund.
50:50 <wrothmonk> plus I'm not sure if its considered a combat feat.
51:10 <wrothmonk> quick mekkis, run three level 4-5 games for me!
51:11 <wrothmonk> :P
52:07 <Mekkis> wrothmonk, well... there is Devil We Know II on SUnday
52:16 <wrothmonk> Cant make it :(
52:35 <Mekkis> Steven, any chance you could run Devil We Know III? I've noticed that you haven't played IV...
52:52 <wrothmonk> my mom's shipping me off to my grandparents who don't want me playing pathfinder all the time  I'm up there.
53:08 <wrothmonk> "all the time" counts as "any"
53:11 <Steven> my weekend is busy as hell, i had to reschedule stuff just to play way of the wicked
53:19 <Mekkis> sure
53:24 <Mekkis> doesn't need to be anytime soon
53:28 <Mekkis> no hurry
56:04 <wrothmonk> gunsmithing does count as a item creation feat so can't do fighter.
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58:40 <Avatar> you can't pick up gunsmithing unless you have a level of gunslinger
58:51 <Mekkis> [citation needed]
58:57 <Avatar> PFS rules
59:02 <Mekkis> [citation needed]
59:08 <Avatar> check additional resources
59:11 <Avatar> not sure
59:13 <Mekkis> I did
59:20 <Mekkis> and there's nothing that says that on additional resources
00:18 <Avatar> sif just spam [citation needed]
00:19 <wrothmonk> checking guide to pfs
00:20 <Avatar> what are you, a robot
00:35 <Mekkis> what do you think?
00:37 <wrothmonk> gunsmithing is not mentioned.
01:30 <Avatar> Gunsmithing does not grant the ability to craft firearms, ammunition, or black powder. Rather, it allows the purchase of bullets, pellets, black powder, and alchemical cartridges (with 1 rank in Craft [alchemy]) at the listed reduced price, but does not grant a discount on the purchase of any firearm. Resold items gained through this feat are worth half the actual cost paid, not half the regular 
01:30 <Avatar> market value for the item. No PC can purchase a gun without this feat, even if they possess the Amateur Gunslinger or Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearm) feats.
01:38 <Avatar> from additional resources, under ultimate combat
02:02 <wrothmonk> alright.
02:12 <Mekkis> doesn't say that you need to be a gunslinger to take the feat
02:23 <Avatar> what do you want to take gunsmithing for
02:26 <Mekkis> just says that you need the feat to buy a gun
02:38 <wrothmonk> I want it for a potential re-build
02:43 <wrothmonk> :P
02:50 <Gelith_> Anyone actually around?
02:57 <Avatar> why is mekkis asking about it
03:05 <wrothmonk> he wants a gun for defunct. 
03:14 <wrothmonk> no clue beyond that.
03:17 <Avatar> do you need a level of gunslinger
03:20 <Avatar> so*
03:30 <wrothmonk> why?
03:37 <Avatar> because you can't buy a gun 
03:48 <wrothmonk> [citation needed]
03:52 <Avatar> it's right there
03:56 <Avatar> last line
03:59 <wrothmonk> once I get the feat.
04:04 <Mekkis>  No PC can purchase a gun without this feat
04:15 <Mekkis> so take the feat, and then buy the gun
04:26 <wrothmonk> yes.
04:56 <wrothmonk> then wait for the feat to be banned for everyone except gunslinger, thus reaping the reward of a re-build.
05:02 <Steven> okay you take the feat, you are now legal to purchase a gun save that the additional resources from where firearms originated specifies this: Equipment: all weapons, armor, and adventuring gear on pages 290–293 with the following restriction: only gunslingers may purchase firearms except cannons, which are not available to anyone; 
05:37 <wrothmonk> that is under a separate book.
05:46 <Steven> doesnt matter
05:52 <wrothmonk> yes it does.
05:57 <Steven> no, it doesnt.
06:14 <wrothmonk> lets not turn it into a kindergarten fight shall we?
06:24 <Avatar> expect table variation
06:28 <Avatar> where they all disallow it
06:34 <Mekkis> I wouldn't
06:52 <Steven> The only reason they list guns in Ultimate combat, other than to offer more guns was so that people wouldnt have to purchase two books to use one class.
06:54 <Avatar> are you serious
06:57 <Mekkis> yes
07:24 <wrothmonk> they should list that restriction under ultimate combat.
07:28 <Avatar> so you're going to tell a GM that it's okay in ultimate combat but not in inner sea world guide so it must be okay?
07:46 <Mekkis> Avatar, guns are listed in three sources
07:50 <wrothmonk> the restriction applies to the book that its under.
07:59 <Mekkis> ISWG, UC and UE. The most recent addition was UE.
08:17 <Mekkis> Note how the UE section does not have that clause
08:18 <Avatar> if it says it's not allowed in one, it's not allowed
08:19 <wrothmonk> guns from the inner sea thing would only be legal for gunslingers.
08:45 <Steven> The reason guns are listed in Ultimate Equipment was so it could be a comprehensive book.
08:49 <Avatar> yeap
08:51 <Mekkis> sure
08:54 <Avatar> not for long
09:05 <Mekkis> and they've reiterated that "No character may purchase a firearm unless she possesses the Gunsmithing feat and firearms are never considered Always Available"
09:42 <Avatar> 8am in melbourne, going to work
09:46 <Avatar> is that for non-society play
09:48 <Mekkis> if they're putting that text in, they've consciously decided NOT to put the stuff from ISWG
09:51 <Gelith_> So I've got a question for you. From your research can you take 10 on knowledge checks?
09:53 <Mekkis> no
09:56 <wrothmonk> hey wait a second...
09:59 <Avatar> where does it say that
09:59 <Mekkis> this is the additional resources page
10:16 <Gelith_> I saw a few posts about it on the rules boards and there doesn't seem to be any agreement. 
10:21 <Avatar> yes
10:21 <Avatar> the additional resources page also says Equipment: all weapons, armor, and adventuring gear on pages 290–293 with the following restriction: only gunslingers may purchase firearms except cannons, which are not available to anyone; 
10:32 <Avatar> as long as the usual rules apply
10:35 <Gelith_> Was gonna post about it but wanted to get a few oppions make sure I'd not missed something.
10:37 <Avatar> like you're not in a stressful situation
10:40 <Mekkis> that's under the ISWG entry
10:45 <Avatar> what kind of gun are you looking at getting
10:48 <wrothmonk> wait nvm.
10:50 <Mekkis> and ISWG came out ages ago
11:04 <Steven> Mekkis, if you want to use a gun, make a forum post and get Brock or Compton to say Yes you can purchase a firearm.
11:05 <Avatar> that doesn't mean it's now legal when it still says it's not
11:13 <Avatar> you can use take 10 on pretty much anything except use magic device
11:21 <Gelith_> Cool, thanks
12:44 <Avatar> gotta run
13:19 <Gelith_> Have a good one
13:27 <wrothmonk> UC is more up to date the ISWG correct?
14:44 <wrothmonk> and UE is also more up to date than UC correct?
15:41 <wrothmonk> under both UC and UE it states the bit about needing fame to purchase guns and needing the gunsmithing feat.
18:22 <Hydrazine> ...I agree with Wroth. If ISWG says "Only gunslingers get guns" (it does), and UC and UE both say "Takes gunsmithing feat, fame, and not always available..." (it does), then its clear you can meet the requirements for the latter two books and obtain a gun from those sources.
18:57 <Hydrazine> Also, good morning.
19:06 <wrothmonk> Goodmorning hydrazine.
23:57 <Mekkis> correct, wrothmonk 
26:39 <Avatar> maybe they changed the rule and forgot to change it on ISWG
26:53 <wrothmonk> Thats what I'm thinking.
27:38 <Avatar> start a forum post if you're serious about taking it mekkis
31:45 <Avatar> mort is asking me if I got a chronicle sheet from a game we both played in about 6 months ago
36:49 <Steven> hey what did you have for dinner two months ago on january 1st
37:35 <wrothmonk> No, thats still memorable since its the new year dinner.
37:40 <Mekkis> ummm... ramen
37:47 <wrothmonk> probably more along the lines on the day after.
38:28 <Mekkis> Avatar, tell her to email her VC
38:37 <Mekkis> I think that might actually be Darkwhite :P
38:47 <Steven> wroth if the new years dinner is memorable... you need better memories.
39:10 <Mekkis> otherwise, tell her to use inkscape :)
39:16 <wrothmonk> I'm still in school man.
39:26 <wrothmonk> that stuff is boring!
39:27 <Mekkis> inkscape, like Phantasmal Killer, solves a lot of problems
39:40 <Mekkis> wrothmonk, learn to use inkscape
39:50 <wrothmonk> inkscape?
39:55 <Mekkis> inkscape
40:07 <Mekkis> vector drawing program
40:29 <Mekkis> very good for doing stuff like filling in chronicle sheets
40:44 <Mekkis> making business cards
41:00 <Mekkis> making vector graphics like eagles holding crates
42:04 <wrothmonk> I'm pretty sure gimp has a lot of these features, if not all that I'm seeing on the wiki.
43:30 <Brunius-> Nah, inkscape is better for that sort of stuff
43:37 <wrothmonk> I'll give it a loot
43:39 <wrothmonk> look*
44:50 <Mekkis> gimp is raster
44:53 <Mekkis> pixel-based
44:58 <Mekkis> inkscape is vector
45:05 <wrothmonk> Ah
45:18 <wrothmonk> ...
45:24 <wrothmonk> it uses x11?
45:35 <Mekkis> or windows
45:42 * wrothmonk grumbles
48:05 <wrothmonk> ok. This does look interesting.
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13:40 <Brunius-> Did Avatar sleep at all last night
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49:06 <Hydrazine> G'day.
51:55 <Wrothmonk> Hello
58:45 <Mekkis> back in the states, I see...
58:57 <Mekkis> how many times were you molested?
59:31 <Hydrazine> Once while there, and by both sets of customs on the way out.
00:13 <Mekkis> is Australian molestation better than US molestation?
00:45 <Hydrazine> Better how? Did I feel more alienated afterwards? Yes.
01:18 <Mekkis> I've never been physically molested by Australian customs
01:23 <Mekkis> they just sic a dog on you
02:45 <Hydrazine> But I did get an IMPERIAL PINT in the Dallas airport. For $7.
03:04 <Mekkis> that's expensive
03:22 <Mekkis> you should have spent a night in Brisbane: we did Day of the Demon
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11:25 <Mort-> I feel squeezed
11:27 <Mort-> :(
11:36 <Mekkis> It wasn't me
11:43 <Mort-> Train is so packed today
11:45 <Mekkis> did the salty juices come out?
11:58 * Mort- is a flatmur
12:01 <Wrothmonk> I know the feeling :(
12:06 <Mort-> I feel I've lost my dex bonus
12:27 <Mekkis> you seen what happens to a block of feta when you squeeze it?
12:29 <Mort-> And can only move at half speed
12:36 <Mort-> Water comes out?
12:45 <Mekkis> salty juices
12:51 <Mekkis> I imagine that's what happened
13:04 <Mort-> I'm not a cheese
13:13 <Wrothmonk> Mekkis thinks you are.
13:21 <Mort-> Clearly I'm not.
13:24 <Mekkis> I need to get a deer animal companion
13:46 <Mort-> Which cheese has 4 paws and a swishy tail
14:06 <Mort-> Paint his nose red and cast air walk on him
14:19 <Wrothmonk> ...
14:36 <Wrothmonk> You will need some more deer and a sleigh then.
14:41 <Mort-> Then tie him to a Carridge and let him pull you into the air
14:56 <Mekkis> ummm
15:00 <Mekkis> cleric of Erastil
15:05 <Wrothmonk> Don't forget the red suit. 
15:09 <Mort-> Bonus points if you're fat, jolly and wear a red suit
15:27 <Mort-> Then go ho ho ho
15:31 <Wrothmonk> Is there an echo?
15:36 <Wrothmonk> :p
16:10 * Mort- giggles
17:00 <Mort-> But frankly i think erastil should have favored the wolf
17:16 <Mort-> He is the master of the hunt
17:34 <Mekkis> you don't hunt wolves
18:16 <Mort-> No. The wolf is a good symbol of the hunt master
18:23 <Mort-> They work in packs too
18:40 <Mekkis> I could get a roc
18:45 <Mekkis> but that's just cheese
18:48 <Mekkis> so I'll avoid it
20:25 <Mort-> I won't get a roc
20:31 <Mort-> I think ill get a lion
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24:06 <Mort-> Mekkis what are your domains besides animal
24:15 <Mekkis> communty
24:18 <Mekkis> community
24:34 <Mort-> What's the domain power for that
24:39 <Mort-> Curious
24:56 <Mort-> I hash only 1 domain for reasons that you know and I'm a wimp
24:57 <Mort-> oh well
25:37 <Mekkis>    Calming Touch (Sp): You can touch a creature as a standard
25:37 <Mekkis> action to heal it of 1d6 points of nonlethal damage + 1 point
25:37 <Mekkis> per cleric level. This touch also removes the fatigued,
25:37 <Mekkis> shaken, and sickened conditions (but has no effect on
25:37 <Mekkis> more severe conditions). You can use this ability a number
25:37 <Mekkis> of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.
26:18 <Mort-> Ah cool
26:31 <Mekkis> not particularly useful
29:19 <Steven> goin to pfs!
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29:59 <Mort-> Sickened and shaken i can see one of my characters trying to throw out every turn
30:16 <Mort-> Actually make that 2
30:17 <Mort-> Possibly
30:17 <Mort-> Domain spells?
31:55 <Mort-> Oh call your reindeer rudolph please :p
31:59 <Mekkis>    Domain Spells: 1st—bless, 2nd—shield other, 3rd—prayer,
31:59 <Mekkis> 4th—status, 5th—telepathic bond, 6th—heroes’ feast, 7th—
31:59 <Mekkis> refuge, 8th—mass cure critical wounds, 9th—miracle.
32:08 <Mekkis> Mort-, I refuse to
32:19 <Mekkis> I'm calling him Dennis
32:25 <Mort-> Haha
32:27 <Mort-> Ok
32:36 <Mekkis> if I'm making a character with real-world references, I want them to be obscure
32:40 <Mort-> I don't think id call my ac that
32:46 <Mekkis> I considered calling him Richie
32:55 <Mort-> Yeah you're probably more subtle then i am
32:59 <Wrothmonk> ???
33:06 <Mort-> Richard is really cool though
33:28 <Wrothmonk> I have no clue what those references are to.
33:32 <Mort-> Mekkis tends to be sneaky too
34:34 <Mort-> Check lfg comics for a warlock named richard
34:43 <Mort-> He is a cool warlock
34:44 <Wrothmonk> I got the richard one
34:54 <Mort-> The Dennis bit i don't know 
34:56 <Wrothmonk> but not dennis.
36:33 <Mort-> No. Anyway out of choice usually my ac name has a slight medival or possibly sylvan feel to it
36:42 <Mort-> I called my roc lyra
37:04 <Mort-> I called my bat basha
37:25 <Wrothmonk> Richard: Chief warlock of the brothers of darkness, lord of the thirteen hells, maser of the bones, emperor of the black, lord of the undead, and mayor of a little village up the coast.
37:32 <Wrothmonk> :P
37:44 <Mort-> Hes cute
38:55 <Mort-> I think richard is cn
39:14 <Mort-> And i have a mephit called socks
40:05 <Wrothmonk> what is a mephit?
41:02 <Mort-> Small leathery humanoid with wings and a mischevious smile
42:01 <Mort-> In socks case. A completely white humanoid
42:42 <Mort-> I always pictured them like imps, without horns and evil thingies
42:47 <Wrothmonk> heh.
43:11 <Mort-> No tail too
43:32 <Mort-> Bit like a minature gargoyle
45:13 <Mekkis> Wrothmonk, see. You're completely wrong
45:14 <Mort-> Mephits are our friends
45:25 <Wrothmonk> ?
45:37 <Mort-> We don't have to worry about them selling our souls on the sly
45:42 <Mekkis> if I wanted to call him "richard", I'd call him richard
45:49 <Mort-> Or preaching morals
45:58 <Mekkis> the character's name is Kernigahn
46:09 <Wrothmonk> Ah
46:35 <Mort-> It may be something i never read or something too obscure
47:32 <Mekkis> Mort-, you should read it
47:52 <Mort-> And which one?
48:11 <Mekkis> the reference I'm getting at
48:13 <Mort-> Don't even know which one ye talking about
48:32 <Mort-> I don't know what it is
48:36 <Mekkis> see what I mean
48:39 <Mekkis> does Wrothmonk get it?
48:44 * Wrothmonk is confused
48:46 <Mort-> How would i know
48:52 <Wrothmonk> Which reference?
48:58 <Mort-> See?
49:07 <Mort-> You lost us mek.
49:10 <Wrothmonk> yes.
49:15 <Mekkis> good
49:33 <Wrothmonk> Do you mean your character's name?
49:39 <Mort-> Its probably something we haven't read/watched before
50:12 <Mekkis> they're linked
50:16 <Mort-> The only character i know with name starting with k should be kerrigan from star craft
50:52 <Mort-> In which should be an aberrant cross blooded vermin whatever sorc
51:08 <Mort-> But never mind. I don't think you want me to do conversions
51:08 <Wrothmonk> Kernigahn sounds familiar but I'm not sure from where.
51:33 <Mort-> I don't get it either.
52:00 <Mort-> But with deadly dealer feat i think i can create gambit
52:33 <Mort-> Id do hexcrafter still so i could "fly" into the air any time i wanted to
52:56 <Mekkis> by basing names off non-fiction rather than fiction, it lets me avoid all the pitfalls of basing a character off a fictional character
52:58 <Mort-> Apprarently marvel dc hereos are expected to fly a lot
53:07 <Wrothmonk> what class is kernighan?
53:10 <Mekkis> cleric
53:11 <Mort-> Cleric
53:14 <Mort-> Animal domain
53:14 <Mekkis> of erastil
53:18 <Wrothmonk> thought so.
53:20 <Mort-> We share similarities
53:29 <Wrothmonk> hrm...
53:30 <Mort-> I also have cleric of erastil
53:45 <Mort-> But totally useless in a fight and i mean it :d
53:46 <Wrothmonk> Yeah I got nothing.
54:02 <Mekkis> hey. Kernigahn has Hold Person
54:14 <Mekkis> he prepares it in all his second level slots :)
55:10 <Mort-> I don't
55:13 <Mort-> What do i do with my second level slot
55:20 <Mort-> My wis only 16
55:29 <Mekkis> Kernigahn's is 18
55:37 <Mekkis> actually 19 - he just hit 4th
55:39 <Mort-> 16 wis
55:44 <Mort-> I'm not meant to do that
55:51 <Mekkis> "meant"
55:56 <Mort-> Look on the bright side
55:57 <Mekkis> I don't plan out my classes
56:13 <Mort-> My wis is 16 lol
56:26 <Mort-> I think i prepared shield other
56:29 <Mort-> Lol
57:55 Mort- has quit (Quit: Bye)
58:04 Mort- ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
58:12 <Mekkis> but did you buy the focus?
58:49 <Mort-> Time to go
58:54 Mort- has quit (Quit: Bye)
03:08 <Wrothmonk> oh… this will be interesting. My dad is going to be playing in the game I'm gming. 
06:05 kapow ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
16:45 kapow has quit (Quit: )
32:00 Tashes ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
47:08 <Mekkis> Wrothmonk, no pressure
13:18 Mort- ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
13:44 <Mort-> Hi?
14:01 <Mekkis> hi...
14:38 <Mort-> Ok. I'm level 3 and didn't play much with spells
14:50 <Mort-> I think i uh. Let my group members do all the woLf
14:52 <Mort-> Work
15:00 <Mekkis> did you buy the focus?
15:10 <Mort-> Yeah i think.
15:16 <Mort-> Its been a long while
15:26 <Mort-> 50 gp ring
16:00 <Mort-> Then i think i just spam bless every fight
16:19 <Mort-> I think i did a command before too. Pity it didnt work
17:00 <Mekkis> Kernigahn never prepares bless
17:01 <Mort-> Command (approach) and take 3 aoos. If it had worked. Sigh
17:10 <Mort-> I prepare it :p
17:22 <Mekkis> he has a flag
17:34 <Mekkis> it's like constant bless, but also gives +1 to damage
17:36 <Mort-> I know that flag thing but nah
17:49 <Mort-> What happens if people magic missile it
18:01 <Mekkis> hasn't happened yet
18:17 <Mort-> I can't wait. Till it does
18:22 <Mekkis> I don't like worrying about that sort of thing until it happens to that character
18:44 <Mort-> I prepare bless
18:56 <Mekkis> Deceased didn't worry about Feeblemind until it hit him
18:56 <Mort-> Shield of faith too i think
19:15 <Mort-> Oh i remember. I prepare cmw on my level 2 slot sometime
19:20 <Mort-> Sometimes :p
19:22 <Mekkis> Mytiazair wasn't suspicious of strangers until he went to Jalmaray and everyone there betrayed him
19:27 <Mort-> Good grief
19:45 <Mekkis> (then he upgraded his headband to give him max ranks in sense motive)
20:01 <Mort-> Why was i so glad i run around with remove fear back then
20:12 <Mort-> And lesser restoration
20:31 <Mort-> As in had scroll
20:38 <Mekkis> but yeah, I shape my character around what actually happens to them
20:55 <Mort-> Ah. Goblins stole my stuff!
21:06 <Mort-> While i was at the tavern!
21:08 <Mekkis> so, IF someone damages Kernigahn's flag, then he'll work out what to do in that situation
21:17 <Mekkis> Mort-, so kill all the goblins
21:20 <Mekkis> CRATE 'em UP!
21:26 <Mort-> Gee. Maybe i shouldn't be frequenting taverns
21:30 <Mort-> We worked it out
21:45 <Mort-> The goblin is going to do something productive with her life
22:16 <Mekkis> yeah
22:20 <Mekkis> push up the daisies!
22:38 <Mekkis> what's the precedence in t[3&19142723>>2*i%30]
22:41 <Mort-> What lol
23:24 <Mort-> What i want to do is to use shield other on my ac
23:30 <Mort-> But i don't think its possible
23:44 <Mort-> No fingers
27:09 <Mort-> Anyway as a person i think gobbies are cute and fuzzy
27:34 <Mekkis> that's before they set your house on fire, poke you with pointy sticks, and eat your family
27:48 <Mort-> If it were possible id like to run a goblin zen archer :p
28:00 <Mekkis> it is...
28:18 <Mort-> Id do alch or gs but just doesn't feel right bringing those into d&d
28:45 <Mekkis> it's not right bringing goblins as PCs into Pathfinder
28:51 <Mort-> Or a Dervish dancing goblin magus
28:56 <Mort-> not without boon
29:04 <Mort-> But yeah would be good fun
29:37 <Mort-> Gobbies are so fuzzy
30:13 <Mort-> I may even skip the alch self ban and do a gobbie alch
30:23 <Mekkis> don't
30:31 <Mekkis> do a gnome who thinks he's a goblin :)
30:39 <Mort-> Gnomes on the other hand. Need to be punted.
30:46 <Mekkis> a gnome adopted by goblins
30:50 <Mort-> Do you really want to encourage me on that?
31:01 <Mekkis> sure...
31:15 <Mort-> First thing ill get alchemist fire and start looking how to twf with it
31:20 <Mekkis> my character will just buy three riding dogs while adventuring with you :)
31:40 <Mort-> Goblin dogs!
31:46 <Mekkis> no
31:48 <Mekkis> riding dogs
31:53 <Mekkis> dogs bigger than the goblin
31:55 <Mort-> Hates dogs and hopper
31:58 <Mort-> Horses
32:03 <Mekkis> you'll be running away for the entire scenario
32:06 <Mekkis> :)
32:24 <Mort-> No. Dog bad. Ratdog good. Or i bomb your dog
32:36 <Mekkis> I have more dogs than you have bombs
33:30 <Mort-> You're clearly violating the don't be a jerk rule
33:52 <Mekkis> hey! you're the one bombing my dogs!
33:56 <Mort-> Xm8 know i don't like dawgs
34:19 <Mort-> I hate dawgs
34:26 <Mekkis> what's a "dawg"
35:16 <Mort-> Dog
54:12 <Wrothmonk> Hey mort
54:25 <Wrothmonk> Did you say a while ago that gnomes deserve to be punted?
56:00 <Wrothmonk> nvm. I don't feel like having a dragon chase after you.
59:54 <Mekkis> brb
00:05 <Mekkis> summoning a celestial dragon to chase Mort- 
02:47 <bendog> insert token "i'm not lurking" statement 
03:02 <Mekkis> you're not
03:05 <Mekkis> I don't believe you!
03:36 <bendog> fair call
04:01 <Mekkis> now you're adding some content, so I'm more convinced...
04:07 <Mekkis> played D&D/Pathfinder much?
04:46 <bendog> been playing pathfinder for... well over a year
05:00 <bendog> custom campaign by our dm 
05:22 <bendog> barely started with it really, play every 2 weeks for about 8 hours in my lounge 
05:48 <Mekkis> nice
05:53 <bendog> i'm perth based so most of the sessions here aren't very good for my time zone
05:55 <Mekkis> are you looking at also playing online?
06:07 <Mekkis> UTC+8, right?
06:11 <bendog> yah
06:43 <Mekkis> what would be a good time?
06:45 <bendog> i've had a few invites for 5am sessions on a saturday morning and thought 'maybe not'
07:02 <Mekkis> the ones at 11am here would be 8am your time
07:03 <bendog> TBH it was probably more like 7 am 
07:30 <bendog> they're on saturday too?
07:39 <Mort-> Sorry wrothmonk
07:43 <bendog> i've really been meaning to give it a go
07:45 <Mekkis> next week there's one on Saturday
08:03 <bendog> but saturdays are my yacht racing days, so i'm not really free
08:06 <Mort-> Are you disappointed with me wrothmonk? :(
08:09 <bendog> not until the season ends
08:24 <Mekkis> the one I'm running will be on Sunday morning. The one I'm running on Saturday is an ongoing campaign, where adding new players is really hard...
08:29 <bendog> plus i have to work out the whole PFS thing
08:35 <Mekkis> There's a Sunday game this weekend
08:39 <Mort-> Just doesn't feel right that he didn't send a dragon after me
08:49 <Wrothmonk> Nah, I expect it. Just as your should expect a dragon sent after you :P
08:52 <Mekkis> it's possible that I'll run one on the 17th
09:00 <Mekkis> Mort-, or a Grolschmir :)
09:03 * Mort- starts meditati
09:16 <bendog> we've got a PF game happening in my house on teh 17th
09:25 <Mort-> I punt gnomes. Do they deserve to be punted?
09:34 <Mekkis> but if you want to show up for the one on the 10th, you're welcome to
09:34 <Wrothmonk> just an FYI mort, I used to play a lot of gnomes in WoW
09:36 <Mekkis> Mort-, no
09:47 <Mort-> I expected the gnome to send a dragon after me. He didn't
09:59 <Mort-> In his place i would have.
10:01 <Mekkis> Grolschmir will send Enkendu after you!
10:14 Wrothmonk is now known as Eryne
10:16 <bendog> Wrothmonk: did you watch the whelps?
10:19 <Eryne> "Surprise!"
10:25 <Mort-> Does that mean the gnome is a better person then me?
10:36 * Mort- is busy in her thoughts and does not notice anything
10:41 * Eryne sends karajix after mort
10:59 <Mort-> Ok!
11:02 <Mort-> /
11:12 Eryne is now known as wrothmonk
11:15 <wrothmonk> the whelps?
11:20 * Mort- hides
12:06 <Mort-> Ok the gnome behaved like he should. So i should punt gnomes
12:48 <bendog> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtvIYRrgZ04
12:57 <Mort-> Oh well there could have been a case of redemption
13:05 <Mort-> But it didn't happen
13:19 <Mekkis> Mort-, you hear a deafening roar of a dragon just outside your hiding place
14:29 * Mort- stays in there and looks out of the peephole
14:43 <Mekkis> you hear the deafening roar. 
14:55 <Mort-> What do i see lol
15:07 <Mekkis> you don't see a dragon
15:50 <Mort-> Cast vanish and walk out
15:50 <Mort-> Stealth mode
16:06 <Mekkis> the noise comes closer
16:28 <Mort-> Do i see anything?
16:46 <Mort-> Run off from the noise. Drop stealth
17:04 <Mort-> While vanished
17:59 <wrothmonk> You now see a gnome tapping his foot and glaring at you.
18:01 Mort- has quit (EOF from client)
18:44 <Mekkis> using Ghost Sound SLA?
19:52 <wrothmonk> ?
20:18 <Mekkis> !spell ghost sound
20:20 <diebot> Mekkis, GHOST SOUND illusion (figment[]) bard 0, sorcerer/wizard 0, magus 0 1 standard action Range: close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)  Comp: V, S, M (a bit of wool or a small lump of wax) Duration: 1 round/level Save: Will disbelief SR:no
20:20 <diebot> Ghost sound allows you to create a volume of sound that rises, recedes, approaches, or remains at a fixed place. You choose what type of sound ghost sound creates when casting it and cannot thereafter change the sound's basic character. The volume of sound created depends on your level. You can produce as much noise as four normal humans per caster
20:21 <diebot> level (maximum 40 humans). Thus, talking, singing, shouting, walking, marching, or running sounds can be created. The noise a ghost sound spell produces can be virtually any type of sound within the volume limit. A horde of rats running and squeaking is about the same volume as eight humans running and shouting. A roaring lion is equal to the noise
20:21 <diebot> from 16 humans, while a roaring dragon is equal to the noise from 32 humans. Anyone who hears a ghost sound receives a Will save to disbelieve. Ghost sound can enhance the effectiveness of a silent image spell. Ghost sound can be made permanent with a permanency spell.
20:40 <Mekkis> gnomes get it as a spell-like ability
20:56 <wrothmonk> I didn't know that.
21:10 <Mekkis> as I said
21:14 <Mekkis> Gnomes are the best race
21:19 <wrothmonk> :P
21:54 <wrothmonk> Well I would assume it was somebody else since you were the one saying that the noises were being made.
22:44 <Mekkis> when you're GMing and someone is casting Ghost Sound, you don't say who's casting it
22:54 <Mekkis> more to the point, SLAs don't have visible components
22:54 <wrothmonk> ah.
25:37 <wrothmonk> well for eryne it would only last 6 seconds since its a round, or is it 10?
26:17 <wrothmonk> I can never remember if a round is 6 seconds or 10
28:57 <wrothmonk> Hrm morts taking a while.
32:49 <Mekkis> 6
34:11 <Mekkis> Fun fact: you can keep casting ghost sound
34:24 <wrothmonk> hem good point
34:32 <wrothmonk> its a SLA so I won't run out of components.
34:43 <wrothmonk> correct?
34:50 <Mekkis> sure
35:05 <Mekkis> but the components are handwaved regardless
04:50 <Avatar> SLA's don't have visible components?
05:00 <Avatar> pretty sure they do
05:03 <Avatar> you're thinking supernatural
06:17 <Mekkis>   Spell-Like Abilities: Usually, a spell-like ability works
06:17 <Mekkis> just like the spell of that name. A spell-like ability has
06:17 <Mekkis> no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it
06:17 <Mekkis> require a focus. The user activates it mentally. Armor
06:17 <Mekkis> never affects a spell-like ability’s use, even if the ability
06:17 <Mekkis> resembles an arcane spell with a somatic component.
07:32 <Avatar> what's the difference between an SLA and a Su then?
08:04 <Mekkis> AoO, SR, dispelability
08:31 <Mekkis> SLAs provoke them, are subject to SR, and can be dispelled.
08:38 <Mekkis> SUs can't
09:11 <Avatar> gotcha
13:37 boris ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
15:52 Jtorres ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
16:52 <Jtorres> hello
17:07 <Mekkis> hi
18:27 <Avatar> Jtorres
18:29 <Avatar> roll up a character !!
18:46 <Jtorres> how
19:06 <Jtorres> how do i roll up a character
19:08 <Avatar> have you played pathfinder before
19:27 <Jtorres> no am new to all that has to do with rpg
19:45 <Jtorres> but am really interested on learning and playing
19:49 <Avatar> have a read through of this: http://www.pfrpg.com.au/newbie_guide.htm
19:57 * wrothmonk drops pile of books on top of Jtorres
19:59 <Avatar> and register an account on www.pfrpg.com.au
20:09 * Avatar throws pile of books at wrothmonk
20:09 <wrothmonk> Get used to buying a ton of books. Or pdfs.
20:20 <wrothmonk> :P
20:30 <Jtorres> yeah that what my friend say lol
20:53 * wrothmonk attempts to cast mage hand to stop books
21:05 <Avatar> download everything from the links on those pages
21:10 <Avatar> on that* page
21:21 <Jtorres> ok 
21:39 <Avatar> the PFS guide looks like you have to pay for it, but you just add it to cart, check out and it's $0.00
22:16 <wrothmonk> the rulebooks given there are generally complete. But some GMs will require that you have the physical book or pdf, which you can get the pathfinder society ones at paizo.com
22:23 <Jtorres> oh ok, all this is at  http://www.pfrpg.com.au/newbie_guide.htm right
22:30 <Avatar> yeah
22:34 <Jtorres> should i register first or later
22:38 <Avatar> first
22:49 <wrothmonk> register with paizo and pfrpg.com.au
22:52 <Avatar> you can use this page for the pathfinder rules: http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/
23:06 <Jtorres> alright
25:38 <Brunius-> All you need is the core rulebook, really
25:52 <Brunius-> And the guide to organised play
26:05 <wrothmonk> Unless you want to have the cool feats/archetypes/spells
26:09 <wrothmonk> :P
26:28 <Brunius-> Others are nice to have, but I've picked up all my others up as bargains
26:36 <Avatar> especially ultimate magic
26:36 <Jtorres> oh ok i got the core book from a friend that left town.  but i still dont get how to fill the character sheet and the rounds stuff
26:59 <Avatar> get the PFS guide and open up chapter 2
27:02 <Avatar> we can guide you through it
27:19 <Brunius-> Try it on your own (the guide should explain it) but feel free to ask us questions
27:24 <Jtorres> ok let me register first 
27:38 <Jtorres> thanks
27:40 <Brunius-> We were all new once... Except Ballig
27:53 <wrothmonk> heh.
28:12 <Avatar> especially ballig you mean
38:27 <Jtorres> do i need to download HydraIRC
38:37 <wrothmonk> not really.
38:41 <Mekkis> you should use an IRC client that isn't mibbit
38:50 <wrothmonk> ^this
39:10 <Jtorres> like which IRC
39:46 <Mekkis> Xchat, mIRC, something you wrote yourself
40:08 <Jtorres> ok
44:15 Brunius- has quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
49:12 Brunius- ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
50:17 <Ulzef> heya kids
50:24 <Mekkis> yo
51:12 wrothmonk has quit (Client exited)
51:53 <Ulzef> you get the call yet mekkis or still up in the air about conquest?
52:51 <Mekkis> no call yet
53:17 <Ulzef> no good
54:22 <Mekkis> yeah
59:49 <Ulzef> does anyone know how to remove the raised level of a metamagic feat or to lower it ?
03:41 <Mekkis> traits
03:48 <Mekkis> Wayang Spellhunter
03:51 <Mekkis> Magical Lineage
13:51 <Mekkis> get a rod instead of taking the feat?
20:10 Brunius ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
22:49 <Ulzef> was looking at elemenetal water sorc with rime spell but didnt wanna have to deal with the +1 spell lvl all the time
22:59 <Jtorres> am going to sign out and log on again ok but under jramireztorres
23:03 <Mekkis> !feat rime spell
23:04 <diebot> Mekkis, RIME SPELL [Metamagic] Creatures damaged by your spells with the cold descriptor become entangled.
23:04 Jtorres has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
23:05 <diebot> Benefit:  The frost of your cold spell clings to the target, impeding it for a short time. A rime spell causes creatures that takes cold damage from the spell to become entangled for a number of rounds equal to the original level of the spell. This feat only affects spells with the cold descriptor. A rime spell uses up a spell slot one level
23:05 <diebot> higher than the spell's actual level. Source: UM
23:34 jramireztorres ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
23:44 <Mekkis> seems... powerful
24:01 <Mekkis> jramireztorres, you know, you can change your name by typing /nick <newname>
24:42 <jramireztorres> oh ok is this at the home page or in this page
24:55 <Mekkis> it's on IRC
25:20 <Mekkis> (and this is why we strongly suggest that you get a proper IRC client, rather than using the in-browser AJAX one)
26:13 <jramireztorres> ok am going to use mIRC
28:49 Brunius has quit (EOF from client)
32:17 <Mekkis> <?entangled
32:18 <diebot> The character is ensnared. Being entangled impedes movement, but does not entirely prevent it unless the bonds are anchored to an immobile object or tethered by an opposing force. An entangled creature moves at half speed, cannot run or charge, and takes a 2 penalty on all attack rolls and a 4 penalty to Dexterity. An entangled character who
32:19 <diebot> attempts to cast a spell must make a concentration check (DC 15 + spell level) or lose the spell.
33:02 Brunius ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
33:02 Brunius has quit (Changing hosts)
33:03 Brunius ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
33:11 <Brunius> Mentlegen
33:42 <Mekkis> what?
33:55 <Mekkis> I thought you changed your password
34:10 <Brunius> Meaning?
34:21 <Mekkis> Mentlegen doesn't work anymore
38:20 <Mekkis> hmmm
39:04 <Mekkis> so... I'll go to whatever con - Melbourne or Sydney - where I can get the whole package: travel, accom, and entry - for the least $$$
39:36 <Brunius> Go to Sydney
45:58 jramireztorres has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
50:38 <Mekkis> ever wondered which animal companion has the highest AC?
51:48 <Brunius> Can't say I have
57:05 <Mekkis> "size" is one of those words that when you see it too much, it looks wrong
00:10 <Mekkis> Ankylosaurus, Archelon, Snapping Turtle and Stegosaurus are the top, with AC of 11
00:14 <Mekkis> ummm
00:15 <Mekkis> 20
00:17 <Mekkis> 21
00:24 <Mekkis> followed by Roc with 20
00:35 <Mekkis> then Giant Moray Eel
01:14 <Brunius> Roc has kind of an advantage, though
01:19 <Brunius> What with the whole flying thing
02:13 <Ulzef> sure
02:19 <Ulzef> does
02:40 <Mekkis> camel has highest str
03:20 <Mekkis> until the advancement
06:59 <Mekkis> ok
07:08 <Mekkis> I'm getting a megaloceros companion
08:21 <Mekkis> I'll probably replace him when I hit 7th
46:25 Wrothmonk ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
08:56 Mort- ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
09:16 * Mort- stretches out  to get a massage
10:21 Wrothmonk is now known as Rumil
10:31 * Rumil uses claws on mort's back
10:54 Rumil is now known as wrothmonk
11:16 <Mort-> Thanks
11:31 <Mort-> You're awesome
11:36 <wrothmonk> :P
12:10 <Mort-> K gnomes aren't all bad. 
12:52 <wrothmonk> Well rumil is human. Remember I decided not to be confusing by having two rumils
13:07 <wrothmonk> but thank you :)
13:25 * Mort- lies down to make a mur rug
13:47 <Mort-> Halflings and gnomes make good sorcs
13:55 <wrothmonk> true.
14:09 <wrothmonk> but I like the extra spell Rumil can get for being human.
14:13 <Mort-> So i assumed you went gnome
14:20 <Mort-> Yeah that's good as well
15:32 <Mort-> Oh just for your info wrothmonk
15:49 <Mort-> If you ever come face to face with something with many attacks
16:01 <Mort-> You're melee sorc right?
16:06 <wrothmonk> Yeah
16:21 <Mort-> Frigid touch wand is your friend
16:37 <wrothmonk> frigid touch? just a sec, lemee pm diebot
16:41 <Mort-> But its costly. Suggest you don't play with it too often
17:32 <Mort-> Against a single foe only. Mind you
17:43 <wrothmonk> hem… how costly?
17:48 <Mort-> Multiple bad guys you're better off either ccing or just mirror image
17:55 <Mort-> Its 4250 for 50 charges
18:11 <Mort-> The thing is that if the creature doesn't have sr
18:15 <Mort-> Its no save
18:26 <wrothmonk> yikes!
18:29 <Mort-> No save on hit melee touch attack staggered
18:31 <wrothmonk> yeah thats costly.
18:37 <Mort-> Told you so
18:46 <Mort-> But there may be occasions you might want it
19:10 <wrothmonk> that comes out to a little less than 100 gp a charge!
19:18 <Mort-> Mr octopus has 8 tentacles and a bite
19:46 <Mort-> He starts flailing them around. You know. Id use that stuff if i were you
21:14 <wrothmonk> I've been wondering if there was a way to allow an octopus onto land and have it as a companion.
21:37 <Mort-> That's an interesting debate
21:41 <Mort-> But homebrew probably
21:45 <wrothmonk> 9 attacks would be nice.
21:59 <Mort-> Remember tentacles are secondary
22:05 <wrothmonk> hem fair point.
22:22 <Mort-> The fun part is debating this. Can a wildshaped druid as an octopus breathe on land?
22:41 <Mort-> No where does it say you lose your ability to breathe on land
22:45 <wrothmonk> that would be awsome.
22:56 <Mort-> Again. That is the land of cheese which I'm not going to look at
23:10 <Mort-> Especially when the druid in question dipped rogue...
23:19 * wrothmonk is a bit of a munchkin
23:20 <Mort-> And has a flying animal companion...
23:23 <wrothmonk> I'll admit it.
23:28 <Mort-> Believe me I'm worse
23:46 <Mort-> Mekkis will skin us both
23:56 wrothmonk is now known as rumil
23:56 <Mort-> Want some argument cheese?
24:05 <rumil> "Not if I skin him first"
24:08 * rumil flexes claws
24:13 rumil is now known as wrothmonk
24:14 <wrothmonk> :P
24:25 <wrothmonk> Sure
24:28 <Mort-> Wear rhino hide armor
24:32 <Mort-> As a druid
25:03 <Mort-> Go and turn into a deinonchyus
25:13 <Mort-> Start pouncing
25:14 <wrothmonk> deinonchyus?
25:20 <Mort-> Yes
25:33 <Mort-> I believe it has like 5 attacks per round or so
27:54 <wrothmonk> dinosaur right?
28:10 <Mort-> Yes
28:25 <wrothmonk> ok yup
28:25 <Mort-> And oh think about this
28:27 <wrothmonk> thats cheese
28:38 mib_y8xagi ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
28:50 <Mort-> Take at least 4 levels of druid for wild shape
29:07 <Mort-> Take shaping focus and beast of the society
29:27 <Mort-> Then take rogue levels for the rest. Of scout arch type
29:40 <Mort-> Everytime you pounce target is flat footed
30:19 <Mort-> That build is glass canonish though
30:34 <wrothmonk> a tad
30:36 <wrothmonk> but
30:56 <wrothmonk> does sneak attack damage get applied to all natural weapons?
30:59 <Mort-> Remember to wear your rhino hide armor before you turn into a deinonchyus!
31:03 <Mort-> Of course
31:26 <Mort-> It says when you charge your target is flat footed
32:11 <wrothmonk> so that would be… 2#1d8+2, 1d6+2, 1d4+1 with 4#4d6 extra sneak attack
32:26 <wrothmonk> at level 8
32:51 <Mort-> So when you charge(pounce) your target is flat footed to all 5 attacks you do on him :p
32:56 * Mort- giggles
33:03 <wrothmonk> so avg damage would be....
33:19 <wrothmonk> whats the average of 4d6?
33:25 <Mort-> 12
33:38 <wrothmonk> thought so.
33:44 <Mort-> Hey don't forget your rhino hide!
33:54 mib_y8xagi has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
34:08 <wrothmonk> so 32 dmg average
34:46 <Mort-> 8d6 more
34:46 <Mort-> 24 average
34:47 <Mort-> From mods
34:47 <Mort-> Btw you use your own physical stats for that
34:47 <Mort-> And add 2 for your str
35:13 <wrothmonk> oh right… druid
35:18 <wrothmonk> I was just using the base stat table.
35:36 <Mort-> Lol yeah so we say we get 18str after shifting
35:52 <Mort-> But well you get the drift
36:16 <wrothmonk> hem let me calculate what wallace would do for comparison.
36:33 <Mort-> Anyway 4 rogue will hive you 2d6 sneak attaj
36:37 <Mort-> Per attack
36:40 <Mort-> Not 1d6
37:00 <Mort-> At 3 rogue you get 2d6 sneak attack already
37:12 <Mort-> And anyway not everything will hit
37:18 <wrothmonk> fair point
37:27 <Mort-> So you need to fix an ac and really run the calcs
37:40 <Mekkis> that's fine really
37:41 <Mort-> Natural attacks always get fked by dr
37:49 <Mekkis> but average of 4d6 is actually 14 :)
37:50 <Mort-> Oh dear
37:56 * Mort- hides
38:36 <Mort-> The mek has come
38:37 <Mort-> And he has heard me talking about cheese
38:37 <Mort-> Wrothmonk
38:37 <Mort-> Lets run before he skins us both!
38:50 <Mekkis> but rhino hide doesn't work while wildshaped
39:06 <Mort-> That's a questionable point
39:08 <Mort-> I heard people argue two ways
39:14 <Mekkis> ok
39:20 <wrothmonk> but assuming everything hits, wallace would do… 2#1d8+4, 2#1d6+4, at level 8 with no +1 weapon
39:21 <Mekkis> then it's Expect Table Variation
39:29 <Mekkis> so it's something to be avoided regardless
39:44 <Mort-> How did you turn into a deinonchyur
39:51 <Mort-> Used beast shape?
40:03 <Mekkis> wildshape into cheese
40:22 <Mort-> He can't wildshape he is a sorc!
40:40 Steven ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
40:43 <wrothmonk> so 30 avg damage for wallace.
40:53 <wrothmonk> assuming I get improved two weapon fighting.
41:02 <Mekkis> who's wallace?
41:03 <wrothmonk> and everything hits.
41:04 <Mort-> And no the evil mekkis is around
41:09 <wrothmonk> My ranger.
41:09 <Steven> i think thats close to my gunslingers average damage....
41:10 <Mort-> Run!
41:14 <wrothmonk> :P
41:17 <Mekkis> at level 2?
41:19 <wrothmonk> what level?
41:22 <Steven> off of one shot.
41:25 <Mort-> He's going to skin us both!
41:26 <wrothmonk> xd
41:43 * Mort- ducks into a hole and takes cover
41:45 <Mekkis> I don't skin, I crate. And I don't crate loyal pathfinders
41:56 <wrothmonk> Rumil skins
42:01 <wrothmonk> prof butcher
42:04 <Mort-> I don't want to be a crate
42:10 <wrothmonk> although now he performs actually.
42:12 <wrothmonk> I think
42:18 <Mort-> I have a ranger profession cook
42:22 <Mort-> i blame my party
42:33 <Steven> oh i was wrong my average damage off of one shot it 26.5
42:45 <Mort-> We were eating a venison carcass for a week
42:46 <wrothmonk> I need to make a gunslinger again.
42:53 <Steven> yeah you do.
43:00 <wrothmonk> My first one died in first steps 2
43:04 <Mort-> I don't approve of gs
43:06 <Mekkis> as he should have
43:07 <Steven> I suggest going 5 into gunslinger, and then 7 into something else.
43:13 <Mort-> Not pfs
43:27 * Mekkis reads a scroll of genocide.
43:37 <Mort-> I have a few quirks and percularities
44:01 <wrothmonk> It doesn't work on cheese mekkis.
44:03 <wrothmonk> :P
44:12 <Mekkis> sure
44:17 <Mekkis> but it works on classes
44:17 * Mort- hugs wrothmonk
44:18 <Steven> and go musketmaster, it seems to draw less hate than the two pistol type of gunslinger
44:27 <Steven> mostly because its way way way way less douchy
44:38 <Mort-> Don't let the evil mekkis get me!
44:40 <Mekkis> unless you use Targetting a lot
44:59 <Mekkis> Mort-, if you were a paladin, you'd be able to tell that I am not evil...
45:00 <Steven> whats targetting?
45:02 <wrothmonk> reloading dual pistols is a pain.
45:21 <Mekkis> where you take a shot at their head and give them the confused condition
45:24 <Mort-> It isn't once you hit level 3
45:29 <Mekkis> or a shot at the leg and put them on the ground
45:29 <Mort-> And also with lots of weapon cords
45:40 <Steven> YOU WERENT SUPPOSED TO TELL HIM!
45:48 <Mekkis> until someone sunders your gun :)
45:52 * Brunius detects evil in a cone
45:54 <wrothmonk> I thought aimed shots were banned?
46:03 <Brunius> aimed shots are
46:05 <Brunius> targetting isn't
46:06 <Steven> called shots is banned
46:11 <Steven> targeting is a class feature
46:13 <wrothmonk> Oh
46:17 <wrothmonk> I see
46:27 <Mort-> Oh if you have sunder happy gms
46:33 <wrothmonk> you detect 4 evil beings brunius.
46:38 <Mort-> You need a fortifying stone
46:44 <Steven> and dont take it, just go 5 gunslinger 7 something else.
46:59 <wrothmonk> rogue!
47:09 <wrothmonk> wait no… touch doesn't lose dex bonus.
47:12 <Mort-> Consider impenetratable enchantment too
47:24 <Steven> flat footed touch is 10+deflection and misc modifiers
47:30 <Mort-> Go magus
47:41 <Steven> and really. you are going against touch... you dont need much more benefits
47:41 <Mort-> Enchant your gun till kingdom come
47:55 <Mort-> Store shocking grasp into your gun
48:02 <wrothmonk> ...
48:05 <wrothmonk> mort
48:06 <Mekkis> until they sunder your gun
48:07 <Mekkis> :)
48:15 <wrothmonk> whats an expensive cheese mekkis?
48:24 <Steven> Gunslinger is as expensive as you can get
48:27 <Mort-> Fortifying stone
48:27 <Mekkis> Roquefort
48:27 <wrothmonk> something /really? expensive?
48:34 <wrothmonk> mort is roquefort then.
48:44 <Mort-> The staff that deceased is using
48:46 <Mekkis> mmm
48:49 <Steven> oh you mean actual cheese
48:49 <Mekkis> what?
48:54 <Mort-> Its 5 cloud kills per day
48:58 <Mekkis> the Staff of Toxins
49:03 <Mekkis> not per day
49:05 <Mekkis> per scenario
49:10 <Mort-> And god knows what else
49:13 <Mekkis> !item staff of toxins
49:14 <diebot> Mekkis, STAFF OF TOXINS [moderate varies] CL:9 none 34200gp, 5lb
49:16 <Mort-> Still sick
49:16 <diebot> This length of hemlock-shrouded oak gives off the faintest whiff of rot and corruption. It allows use of the following spells: • Stinking cloud (1 charge) • Cloudkill (2 charges) Source: Ultimate Equipment
49:23 <Mort-> And he got it cheap
49:27 <Mekkis> yeah
49:27 <Steven> Wroth... go Paladin/Gunslinger!
49:30 <Mekkis> 12.6k :)
49:41 <Steven> well i should say Paladin/Mysterious Stranger
49:55 <wrothmonk> No pallys… please no.
49:55 <Mekkis> what about diviner/gunslinger?
50:00 <wrothmonk> I hate palladins.
50:03 <Mekkis> !spell Named Bullet
50:04 <diebot> Mekkis, NAMED BULLET divination ([]) inquisitor 4, ranger 3, sorcerer/wizard 4, witch 4 1 standard action Range: touch one piece of ammunition or one thrown weapon Comp: V, S, M/DF (an item from the selected creature or creature type) Duration: 10 minutes/level or until discharged Save: Will negates (harmless, object) SR:yes (harmless,
50:05 <diebot> object)
50:05 <diebot> You imbue the target with deadly accuracy against a selected creature type (and subtype for humanoids or outsiders) or a specific creature you know and can name. When used against the selected creature, the ammunition never misfires and is unaffected by concealment (but not total concealment), and at a range of 30 feet or less, the attack targets
50:05 <diebot> the selected creature's touch AC. When the target hits the selected creature, you must overcome that creature's spell resistance, or this spell has no effect. A normal hit scored using the target against the selected creature is considered to be a critical threat and deals 1 extra point of damage per caster level (maximum 20), which is not
50:05 <diebot> multiplied on a critical hit. A natural critical hit deals the same extra damage, but that damage is multiplied due to the critical. Once the target is used to attack the selected creature, successfully or not, this spell is discharged.
50:14 <Mort-> You get problem with mis fires
50:30 <Mort-> Quis
50:34 <Mekkis> ranger/gunslinger might work
50:56 <Mort-> Quis
51:04 <Mekkis> Que?
51:05 <Steven> mekkis, thats exactly what im doing... Inquisitor/Gunslinger Named Bullet.
51:05 <Mort-> Divine whatever to your gun
51:14 <Mort-> Inquisitor
51:29 <wrothmonk> man this channel is starting to stink of cheese I think
51:33 <Mort-> Add divine favor litany of righteousness
51:35 <Mort-> Fun stuff
51:39 <Mekkis> fair enough. Diviner gets to make the gun the bonded weapon
51:43 <Mekkis> so cheap enchantments
51:50 <Mort-> Time to go
51:55 <Mekkis> and bonuses to initiative is always good
51:56 Mort- has quit (Quit: Bye)
51:56 <Mekkis> damn
52:04 <Mekkis> I might actually make that character
52:15 <wrothmonk> I'm going to go punch trees for a while.
52:25 <Steven> My Gunquisitor has an initiative of +13 w/o imp initiative
52:26 <wrothmonk> ping me if needed.
52:45 * Ping reply from wrothmonk: ? second(s)
52:45 <Steven> Wrothmonk i need you!
52:49 <Mekkis> * Ping reply from wrothmonk: ? second(s)
53:10 * Ping reply from wrothmonk: 1362603590.24 second(s)
53:16 <Steven> so mekkis what up
53:24 <Mekkis> played Day of the Demon
53:26 <Brunius-> Wroth, it's always like that
53:28 <Mekkis> fun times
53:34 <wrothmonk> yes?
53:47 <Steven> wroth... you rock.
53:48 <Brunius-> Re cheese
53:50 <Steven> that is all.
53:56 <wrothmonk> ...
54:01 <Mekkis> my VC considers a lot of stuff evil that I wouldn't
54:16 <Brunius-> Such as
54:17 <wrothmonk> You interrupt my blissful punching of trees to tell me that?
54:24 <Mekkis> ok
54:28 <Brunius-> Yes
54:33 wrothmonk is now known as Rumil
54:40 * Rumil goes wolverine on Steven
54:43 <Brunius-> What did those trees ever do to you
54:48 Rumil is now known as wrothmonk
54:51 <wrothmonk> that is all.
54:59 <Mekkis> we meet an imp, Itzamna's there, and the imp's like "I'll tell you everything if you let me go through that portal"
55:09 <Mekkis> and Itzamna's like "Sure (roll bluff)"
55:09 Steven is now known as Dan_Burns
55:57 <Mekkis> so we find the portal, the imp goes for the portal, and Itzamna's like "Hell no. Perfection full-attacks the crap out of the imp"
55:58 <Dan_Burns> !throw 1d20+12; 1d20+12; 1d20+7
55:59 <diebot> Dan_Burns, 1d20+12: [1d20=20] 32; 1d20+12: [1d20=16] 28; 1d20+7: [1d20=3] 10
56:31 <Mekkis> and the VC's like "If you do that, it's an evil act"
56:39 <Mekkis> and I'm like "WTF?"
56:45 <Dan_Burns> determination reroll the 3
56:50 <Dan_Burns> !throw 1d20+7
56:51 <diebot> Dan_Burns, 1d20+7: [1d20=11] 18
56:51 <Mekkis> really?
56:52 <Brunius-> Aren't imps evil
56:55 <Mekkis> yes
57:01 <Mekkis> isn't my character chaotic good?
57:23 <Dan_Burns> !throw 3d12+36
57:23 <diebot> Dan_Burns, 3d12+36: [3d12=11,9,9] 65
57:32 <Brunius-> While not holding to your word isn't honorable, I wouldn't consider it evil
57:35 <Dan_Burns> Wroth your character takes 65 points of damage.
57:48 <Dan_Burns> oh shit i crit...
57:52 <Dan_Burns> my bad
58:06 <Dan_Burns> !thow 1d20+12
58:16 <Dan_Burns> !throw 1d20+12
58:17 <diebot> Dan_Burns, 1d20+12: [1d20=10] 22
58:18 <Brunius-> Hell, most pathfinder agents are required to lie in some way
58:26 <Dan_Burns> those look like  they confirm to me
58:53 <Dan_Burns> !throw 6d12+72
58:54 <diebot> Dan_Burns, 6d12+72: [6d12=6,9,8,7,2,6] 110
59:23 <Dan_Burns> Wroth, your character actually takes 110 points of damage...  All without me using bane.
59:38 <Dan_Burns> would would increase the damage by 6d6+6
00:56 <Dan_Burns> oh yeah, the enhancement bonus multiplies the extra damage doesnt, so it would be +12
01:29 <Dan_Burns> it cost me 18g to do that.
01:53 <Dan_Burns> also, i love the preachers ability to reroll
02:16 Dan_Burns is now known as Steven
02:31 <Steven> I used it today to get out of 2 misfires.
03:04 <Steven> At 3rd level, the preacher is a person of few words on the battlefield, but those words hold great power and authority. Once per day, the inquisitor can use this ability to create one of the following effects. Each is a free action to use.
03:05 <Steven> Aggression: The preacher may reroll an attack roll that she just made before the results of the roll are revealed. She must take the result of the reroll, even if it’s worse than the original roll.
03:14 <Steven> Whenever the preacher could select a bonus teamwork feat (at 3rd, 6th, 9th, 12th, 15th, and 18th level), she can instead choose to increase her number of uses per day of this ability by one. 
03:15 <Steven> This ability replaces solo tactics.
03:23 <Mekkis> so Steven: if I was making the gunslinger/diviner, would I start with a diviner, or with gunslinger?
03:35 <Steven> diviner is a wizard right?
03:38 <Mekkis> yeah
03:48 <Steven> yeah start with the gunslinger, will net you 4 more hp
03:50 <Mekkis> I want to get a gun as the bonded weapon
07:55 <Mekkis> I'll use a Culverin
09:30 <Steven> are you sure?
09:40 <Steven> have you read the actual weapon entry?
10:23 * wrothmonk stops punching trees and starts launching mass amounts of rocket fuel into space
10:25 <Steven> plus you cant its not allowed in pfs
11:48 <Steven> wroth why you so silly?
14:02 <wrothmonk> 'Cause :P
15:23 <wrothmonk> I like to vary my video game genres 
17:43 <Steven> me too
17:54 <Mekkis> maybe a coat pistol
18:01 <Mekkis> damn
18:17 <Mekkis> why do they make two decent weapons, and a page full of jokes
18:40 <wrothmonk> because screw the rule we are adding pandas? 
18:57 <wrothmonk> wait no… wrong game.
19:07 <Steven> because they like to offer people flavor items
19:18 <Steven> and not everything is PFS
19:41 <Mekkis> I know
20:08 <Mekkis> so
20:16 <Mekkis> Axe musket or warhammer musket?
20:30 <Steven> neither?
20:37 <Mekkis> what do you suggest?
21:06 <Mekkis> Pistol?
21:09 <Mekkis> Double Hackbutt?
21:25 <Steven> double hackbutt illegal
21:33 <Steven> i suggest getting weapon focus musket, point blank shot, rapid shot, snap shot, improved snap shot
21:48 <Mekkis> so you're suggesting I get a musket
21:57 <Steven> oh yeah
22:01 <Steven> !feat snap shot
22:02 <diebot> Steven, SNAP SHOT [Combat] With a ranged weapon, you can take advantage of any opening in your opponent's defenses. Prerequisites: Dex 13, Point-Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus, base attack bonus +6. Benefit: While wielding a ranged weapon with which you have Weapon Focus, you threaten squares within 5 feet of you. You can make attacks of
22:03 <diebot> opportunity with that ranged weapon. You do not provoke attacks of opportunity when making a ranged attack as an attack of opportunity. Normal: While wielding a ranged weapon, you threaten no squares and can make no attacks of opportunity with that weapon.
22:03 <diebot> Benefit:  Source: UC
22:21 <Steven> improved snap shot increases it out to a range of 10ft
22:31 <Mekkis> ummm... diviner...
22:52 <Steven> Gunviner?
23:12 <Mekkis> if I'm throwing 7 levels into diviner, AoOs aren't going to be my thing
23:32 <Steven> if thats what you want to believe.
24:01 <Mekkis> hmm
24:13 <Mekkis> maybe it's not a good idea to start with
24:42 <Steven> really is not a great idea to pick up an arcane class
25:07 <Steven> they already do more than enough with vs touch.
25:21 <Mekkis> but Named Bullet...
25:31 <Steven> can be read off of a scroll
25:40 <Steven> so get UMD
25:55 <Steven> its what my Gunquisitor is going to do.
25:56 <Mekkis> and here I was, thinking that Mytiazair spending 50gp a shot was being expensive
27:57 <Steven> its like 1k to auto crit if you hit.
28:07 <Steven> which if you can hand the scroll off to a wizard/sorc
28:28 <Steven> and have them burn a turn doing it, during a final encounter
29:15 <Mekkis> I think Deceased will just prepare and cast it before the combat if there's an archer/gunslinger in the party
30:15 <Steven> i mean my character does 4d12+48 on a crit, with that spell it would be +8 to that, if i hit a nat 20 on the attack roll while named bullet it does +32 damage.  Then i get to take two more attacks.
31:10 <Mekkis> your character needs to start adventuring with Deceased. He has nothing to prepare in his 4th and 5th level divination-only slots
31:27 <Steven> in a bad situation, i'd drop 1k gold to do 4d12+56 damage
31:48 <Mekkis> last scenario, he prepared Arcane Sight in his 5th level slot
31:50 <Steven> sorry i keep forgetting i upped my dex, i do +13 damage now.
32:37 <Steven> 4d12+60 damage on a BBEG is a damn good chunk of his life... all that before bane as well.
32:51 <Mekkis> I know
32:58 <Mekkis> hey Brunius!
33:03 <Mekkis> run a 7-11 for us!
33:16 <Steven> so if you name bullet while baning, 4d12+68+2d6, followed by two more shots.
33:31 <Mekkis> hmmm
33:40 <Mekkis> what are the rules for non-gunslingers using guns?
33:47 <wrothmonk> they cant
33:57 <Steven> you take the non proficiency bonus of -4
34:13 <wrothmonk> no I think its "you can't" period
34:16 <wrothmonk> let me check again
34:46 <Mekkis> No character may purchase a firearm unless she possesses the Gunsmithing feat and firearms are never considered Always Available; a character must possess enough Fame to purchase any firearm not found on a Chronicle sheet or granted by a class feature
35:15 <Steven> anyone can use a gun, but only gunslingers can purchase guns.
35:22 <Steven> so if i wanted to i could hand my musket off to someone else.
35:54 <Steven> they could fire it, and then spend a full round action to reload it.
35:55 <Mekkis> is says that you need the Gunsmithing feat to buy a gun
36:19 <Steven> which you cant take gunsmithing unless you are a gunslinger.
36:26 <Mekkis> !feat gunsmithing
36:27 <diebot> Mekkis, GUNSMITHING [] You know the secrets of repairing and restoring firearms.  Benefit: If you have access to a gunsmith's kit, you can create and restore firearms, craft bullets, and mix black powder for all types of firearms. You do not need to make a Craft check to create firearms and ammunition or to restore firearms. Crafting Firearms: You
36:28 <diebot> can craft any early firearm for a cost in raw materials equal to half the price of the firearm. At your GM's discretion, you can craft advanced firearms for a cost in raw materials equal to half the price of the firearm. Crafting a firearm in this way takes 1 day of work for every 1,000 gp of the firearm's price (minimum 1 day).  Crafting
36:28 <diebot> Ammunition: You can craft bullets, pellets, and black powder for a cost in raw materials equal to 10% of the price. If you have at least 1 rank in Craft (alchemy), you can craft alchemical cartridges for a cost in raw materials equal to half the price of the cartridge. At your GM's discretion, you can craft metal cartridges for a cost in raw
36:28 <diebot> materials equal to half the cost of the cartridge. Crafting bullets, black powder, or cartridges takes 1 day of work for every 1,000 gp of ammunition (minimum 1 day). Restoring a Broken Firearm: Each day, with an hour's worth of work, you can use this feat to repair a single firearm with the broken condition. You can take time during a rest period
36:28 <diebot> to restore a broken firearm with this feat. Special: If you are a gunslinger, this feat grants the following additional benefit. You can use this feat to repair and restore your initial, battered weapon. It costs 300 gp and 1 day of work to upgrade it to a masterwork firearm of its type.
36:28 <diebot> Benefit:  Source: UC
36:37 <Steven> its not a rule, its a policy.
36:47 <Mekkis> it's not on Additional Resources
37:42 <Steven> hey if you can find a work around let me know mekkis, i'll be glad to tell brock about it so he can close it.
38:06 <Mekkis> Steven, I'm not seeing anywhere where it says that you need to be a gunslinger to buy a gun
38:10 <Mekkis> that's what I'm getting at
38:21 <Mekkis> or is it somewhere other than Additional Resources?
38:35 <wrothmonk> well it looked like if you have exotic weapon proficiency and the gunsmithing feat you can get a gun with fame.
38:52 <wrothmonk> and use it
39:05 <Mekkis> and if that's a "loophole" then yes, I think it should be looked at.
40:42 <Mekkis> I should get Defunct a GUN!
40:58 <wrothmonk> I should buy rumil a gun
41:09 <Mekkis> yeah... and imp, with a GUN
41:10 <wrothmonk> if they change it I may get a free rebuild :D
41:15 <Mekkis> :)
41:39 <wrothmonk> except… I'm going to have a hard time getting the feats.
41:52 <Mekkis> you don't need the Exotic Weapon Proficiency
42:00 <wrothmonk> good point
42:40 <wrothmonk> I believe I have the fame and the cash
42:53 <Steven> you cant buy a gun.
43:04 <Steven> The first place guns were introduced was the inner sea world guide
43:04 <Mekkis> where does it say that/
43:06 <Mekkis> ?
43:16 <Steven>  Equipment: all weapons, armor, and adventuring gear on pages 290–293 with the following restriction: only gunslingers may purchase firearms except cannons, which are not available to anyone;
43:47 <wrothmonk> where is that?
45:05 <wrothmonk> inner sea world guide
45:29 <Steven> http://paizo.com/products/btpy8ief/discuss?Pathfinder-Campaign-Setting-The-Inner-Sea-World-Guide#tabs
45:35 <Mekkis> so, sure
45:46 <Mekkis> you can get a gun, if you buy it out of UE
45:48 <Mekkis> umm
45:49 <Mekkis> UC
46:00 <wrothmonk> yeah looks like it.
46:10 <wrothmonk> since it is under a separate book
46:25 <Mekkis> better get one for Rumil now
46:29 <Mekkis> :P
46:31 <wrothmonk> yes.
46:39 <Mekkis> I want to get one for Defunct :)
47:04 <Steven> no, thats not how it works, they dont list redudancies if they can help it in the Additional resource page
47:18 <Steven> otherwise the document would be about 4 times as long.
48:00 <Mekkis> then why is Rich Parents disallowed twice?
48:24 <Steven> I dunno, message brock about it.
48:33 <wrothmonk> looks like I got enough fame..
48:44 <wrothmonk> now then how to get the feat...
49:00 <Mekkis> I'm having a hard enough time convincing a fellow player that he can't play a paladin of Calistra...
49:28 <Mekkis> there's no way they'd buy the "because it's not allowed from ISWG, it's not allowed from UC" stuff
49:41 <Mekkis> wrothmonk, level of fighter?
49:49 <wrothmonk> I don't want to do that.
49:57 <wrothmonk> It could end up just being a refund.
50:13 <wrothmonk> plus I'm not sure if its considered a combat feat.
50:33 <wrothmonk> quick mekkis, run three level 4-5 games for me!
50:34 <wrothmonk> :P
51:29 <Mekkis> wrothmonk, well... there is Devil We Know II on SUnday
51:39 <wrothmonk> Cant make it :(
51:57 <Mekkis> Steven, any chance you could run Devil We Know III? I've noticed that you haven't played IV...
52:15 <wrothmonk> my mom's shipping me off to my grandparents who don't want me playing pathfinder all the time  I'm up there.
52:31 <wrothmonk> "all the time" counts as "any"
52:34 <Steven> my weekend is busy as hell, i had to reschedule stuff just to play way of the wicked
52:42 <Mekkis> sure
52:46 <Mekkis> doesn't need to be anytime soon
52:51 <Mekkis> no hurry
54:46 Brunius has quit (EOF from client)
55:27 <wrothmonk> gunsmithing does count as a item creation feat so can't do fighter.
58:03 <Avatar> you can't pick up gunsmithing unless you have a level of gunslinger
58:14 <Mekkis> [citation needed]
58:20 <Avatar> PFS rules
58:25 <Mekkis> [citation needed]
58:31 <Avatar> check additional resources
58:34 <Avatar> not sure
58:36 <Mekkis> I did
58:43 <Mekkis> and there's nothing that says that on additional resources
59:41 <Avatar> sif just spam [citation needed]
59:42 <wrothmonk> checking guide to pfs
59:43 <Avatar> what are you, a robot
59:58 <Mekkis> what do you think?
00:00 <wrothmonk> gunsmithing is not mentioned.
00:53 <Avatar> Gunsmithing does not grant the ability to craft firearms, ammunition, or black powder. Rather, it allows the purchase of bullets, pellets, black powder, and alchemical cartridges (with 1 rank in Craft [alchemy]) at the listed reduced price, but does not grant a discount on the purchase of any firearm. Resold items gained through this feat are worth half the actual cost paid, not half the regular 
00:53 <Avatar> market value for the item. No PC can purchase a gun without this feat, even if they possess the Amateur Gunslinger or Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearm) feats.
01:01 <Avatar> from additional resources, under ultimate combat
01:25 <wrothmonk> alright.
01:35 <Mekkis> doesn't say that you need to be a gunslinger to take the feat
01:46 <Avatar> what do you want to take gunsmithing for
01:49 <Mekkis> just says that you need the feat to buy a gun
02:01 <wrothmonk> I want it for a potential re-build
02:06 <wrothmonk> :P
02:20 <Avatar> why is mekkis asking about it
02:28 <wrothmonk> he wants a gun for defunct. 
02:37 <wrothmonk> no clue beyond that.
02:40 <Avatar> do you need a level of gunslinger
02:43 <Avatar> so*
02:53 <wrothmonk> why?
03:00 <Avatar> because you can't buy a gun 
03:11 <wrothmonk> [citation needed]
03:15 <Avatar> it's right there
03:19 <Avatar> last line
03:22 <wrothmonk> once I get the feat.
03:26 <Mekkis>  No PC can purchase a gun without this feat
03:38 <Mekkis> so take the feat, and then buy the gun
03:49 <wrothmonk> yes.
04:19 <wrothmonk> then wait for the feat to be banned for everyone except gunslinger, thus reaping the reward of a re-build.
04:25 <Steven> okay you take the feat, you are now legal to purchase a gun save that the additional resources from where firearms originated specifies this: Equipment: all weapons, armor, and adventuring gear on pages 290–293 with the following restriction: only gunslingers may purchase firearms except cannons, which are not available to anyone; 
05:00 <wrothmonk> that is under a separate book.
05:09 <Steven> doesnt matter
05:15 <wrothmonk> yes it does.
05:20 <Steven> no, it doesnt.
05:37 <wrothmonk> lets not turn it into a kindergarten fight shall we?
05:47 <Avatar> expect table variation
05:51 <Avatar> where they all disallow it
05:57 <Mekkis> I wouldn't
06:15 <Steven> The only reason they list guns in Ultimate combat, other than to offer more guns was so that people wouldnt have to purchase two books to use one class.
06:17 <Avatar> are you serious
06:20 <Mekkis> yes
06:47 <wrothmonk> they should list that restriction under ultimate combat.
06:51 <Avatar> so you're going to tell a GM that it's okay in ultimate combat but not in inner sea world guide so it must be okay?
07:09 <Mekkis> Avatar, guns are listed in three sources
07:13 <wrothmonk> the restriction applies to the book that its under.
07:21 <Mekkis> ISWG, UC and UE. The most recent addition was UE.
07:39 <Mekkis> Note how the UE section does not have that clause
07:41 <Avatar> if it says it's not allowed in one, it's not allowed
07:42 <wrothmonk> guns from the inner sea thing would only be legal for gunslingers.
08:08 <Steven> The reason guns are listed in Ultimate Equipment was so it could be a comprehensive book.
08:13 <Mekkis> sure
08:27 <Mekkis> and they've reiterated that "No character may purchase a firearm unless she possesses the Gunsmithing feat and firearms are never considered Always Available"
09:09 <Avatar> is that for non-society play
09:10 <Mekkis> if they're putting that text in, they've consciously decided NOT to put the stuff from ISWG
09:16 <Mekkis> no
09:19 <wrothmonk> hey wait a second...
09:22 <Avatar> where does it say that
09:22 <Mekkis> this is the additional resources page
09:44 <Avatar> the additional resources page also says Equipment: all weapons, armor, and adventuring gear on pages 290–293 with the following restriction: only gunslingers may purchase firearms except cannons, which are not available to anyone; 
10:03 <Mekkis> that's under the ISWG entry
10:08 <Avatar> what kind of gun are you looking at getting
10:11 <wrothmonk> wait nvm.
10:12 <Mekkis> and ISWG came out ages ago
10:27 <Steven> Mekkis, if you want to use a gun, make a forum post and get Brock or Compton to say Yes you can purchase a firearm.
10:28 <Avatar> that doesn't mean it's now legal when it still says it's not
12:50 <wrothmonk> UC is more up to date the ISWG correct?
14:07 <wrothmonk> and UE is also more up to date than UC correct?
15:04 <wrothmonk> under both UC and UE it states the bit about needing fame to purchase guns and needing the gunsmithing feat.
17:45 <Hydrazine> ...I agree with Wroth. If ISWG says "Only gunslingers get guns" (it does), and UC and UE both say "Takes gunsmithing feat, fame, and not always available..." (it does), then its clear you can meet the requirements for the latter two books and obtain a gun from those sources.
18:20 <Hydrazine> Also, good morning.
18:29 <wrothmonk> Goodmorning hydrazine.
23:19 <Mekkis> correct, wrothmonk 
26:02 <Avatar> maybe they changed the rule and forgot to change it on ISWG
26:16 <wrothmonk> Thats what I'm thinking.
27:01 <Avatar> start a forum post if you're serious about taking it mekkis
31:08 <Avatar> mort is asking me if I got a chronicle sheet from a game we both played in about 6 months ago
36:12 <Steven> hey what did you have for dinner two months ago on january 1st
36:58 <wrothmonk> No, thats still memorable since its the new year dinner.
37:03 <Mekkis> ummm... ramen
37:10 <wrothmonk> probably more along the lines on the day after.
37:51 <Mekkis> Avatar, tell her to email her VC
38:00 <Mekkis> I think that might actually be Darkwhite :P
38:10 <Steven> wroth if the new years dinner is memorable... you need better memories.
38:32 <Mekkis> otherwise, tell her to use inkscape :)
38:39 <wrothmonk> I'm still in school man.
38:49 <wrothmonk> that stuff is boring!
38:50 <Mekkis> inkscape, like Phantasmal Killer, solves a lot of problems
39:03 <Mekkis> wrothmonk, learn to use inkscape
39:13 <wrothmonk> inkscape?
39:18 <Mekkis> inkscape
39:30 <Mekkis> vector drawing program
39:52 <Mekkis> very good for doing stuff like filling in chronicle sheets
40:06 <Mekkis> making business cards
40:22 <Mekkis> making vector graphics like eagles holding crates
41:27 <wrothmonk> I'm pretty sure gimp has a lot of these features, if not all that I'm seeing on the wiki.
42:53 <Brunius-> Nah, inkscape is better for that sort of stuff
43:00 <wrothmonk> I'll give it a loot
43:02 <wrothmonk> look*
44:13 <Mekkis> gimp is raster
44:16 <Mekkis> pixel-based
44:21 <Mekkis> inkscape is vector
44:27 Steven has quit (Quit: )
44:28 <wrothmonk> Ah
44:41 <wrothmonk> ...
44:47 <wrothmonk> it uses x11?
44:58 <Mekkis> or windows
45:05 * wrothmonk grumbles
47:28 <wrothmonk> ok. This does look interesting.
51:27 Topic for #d&d is: PFS: Sun 10th 11am (tier 1-7,Mekkis) / Sat 16th 11am (tier 1-5,Wrothmonk) | WotW: Sat 9th 2pm || All topic times are AEDT (UTC+11:00); set up your timezone on the site for local times in the Schedule! | D&D and Pathfinder Online http://www.pfrpg.com.au
51:27 Topic for #d&d set by Avatar at Sun Mar  3 22:07:37 2013
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