// #eevblog — 2019-11-04
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02:47:15 <DHess_US> <Halcyon> But the cost of additional RAM is negligible compared to back then
02:47:41 <DHess_US> Not at the rate working set size is growing.
02:49:01 <DHess_US> T3sl4, I tend to prefer 1206 simply so I can route 1 or 2 traces underneath.
02:50:10 <DHess_US> Microsoft storage spaces has defeated me. Switched controller to AHCI and did all updates and it is still kicking my working volume out.
02:50:41 <DHess_US> So I'm going to copy that volume off and change it to mirror from parity.
02:51:01 <DHess_US> Next week I will buy a used 8 port Areca 1210
02:52:42 <DHess_US> https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2019/10/whatsapp_sues_n.html
02:58:25 <coppice> I think the devil is in the details on that one. if they object to probing they are self-defeating idiots, but there might be more to it
02:59:31 <coppice> the laws related to this stuff are badly broken. people get successfully prosecuted just for checking if a site is secure before using it
03:00:37 <DHess_US> I suspect the lawsuit is more about the publicity. NRO was selling the hack to governments who were using it to target journalists and civilians.
03:01:10 <coppice> they ain't american. why should they care?
03:01:40 <DHess_US> Some people got "disappeared". This guy was one of the targets, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamal_Khashoggi
03:02:08 <DHess_US> WhatsApp is an American company and NRO is israeli.
03:02:21 <coppice> he doesn't count. he had a target on his back anyway
03:02:33 <DHess_US> And NRO through Whats
03:02:50 <DHess_US> And NRO through WhatsApp helped the Sauds assassinate him.
03:03:21 <DHess_US> I doubt their legal case can go anywhere but the point would be the publicity of what NRO and NRO's clients were doing.
03:04:03 <DHess_US> The Schneier link has a link to details of exactly what the hack was.
03:04:22 <coppice> I doubt the Saudis needed any help. they bumped him off in one of their own sites, in a very unsubtle, couldn't give a damn, kind of way
03:04:53 <DHess_US> Maybe not but they used the NRO hack to track the spy on the guy.
03:05:30 <coppice> if you have weaknesses its no good whining about people who find them. That's the nature of networks
03:05:38 <DHess_US> https://research.checkpoint.com/the-nso-whatsapp-vulnerability-this-is-how-it-happened/
03:06:02 <DHess_US> That isn't the point. The lawsuit brings publicity to NRO and everybody associated with them.
03:06:20 <DHess_US> If the lawsuit gets to the discovery phase, it will be even worse for NRO.
03:06:53 <coppice> isn't hard to achieve meaningful discovery on foreign companies?
03:07:01 <coppice> isn't it hard
03:07:03 <DHess_US> Instead of making clames that NRO is helping to kill people, they can dig for evidence through the courts and publicize it.
03:07:46 <DHess_US> Have to ask a lawyer that. There *are* some laws which cover companies cooperating with governments to help kill people.
03:08:27 <DHess_US> That could make things uncomfortable for US based clients of NRO.
04:53:17 <DHess_US> https://i.ibb.co/cwhZTrS/IMG-0370.jpg
05:27:50 <DHess_US> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/S9OYTvby/IMG_1792.JPG
05:44:18 <coppice> is that actually a boat? it looks like a pontoon. can you store pontoons without a permit?
05:44:53 <coppice> coiuld you build an entire house without a permit, by making it bouyant?
05:58:22 <DHess_US> Possibly.
05:58:40 <DHess_US> They might stop you by saying you don't have a permit for a house boat.
05:59:40 <DHess_US> I've hear of people installing plastic 50 gallon drums under their wooden deck to act as an emergency raft if there is a flood.
06:00:38 <DHess_US> Where I am they require permits to pour any concrete. Even a concrete pad for a shed or air conditioner requires a permit.
06:01:07 <DHess_US> So when I expanded my patio, I put down paving stones over 4 inches of concrete.
06:01:15 <DHess_US> No permits required for paving stones.
06:04:40 <coppice> if its not on something that floats its not really a deck, is it? :)
06:12:47 Join: DogWomble ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
06:12:59 Mode: (by ChanOP) +o DogWomble
06:17:01 <DHess_US> They still call it a patio deck.
06:17:18 Join: rust_collector ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
06:17:47 <DHess_US> "b. An unroofed platform, typically with a railing, that adjoins a building or is built on a rooftop."
06:48:14 <rust_collector> hey-o people
06:49:53 <rust_collector> yesterday, I used the (more or less) constant current load for the first time, for something usefull. YAAY!
06:51:29 <rust_collector> usb ports on the kids confuser was acting weird, especially when he had a particular keyboard plugged in. I figured it might hit some kind of overcurrent limit or something
06:52:42 <rust_collector> oh well, it was not that. the port gave me 3.5A, which was the point where the usb cable started smoking, so I guess it is more than enough to run a keyboard
07:22:42 Join: ThunderSqueak ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
07:22:42 Mode: (by ChanOP) +o ThunderSqueak
07:53:07 Join: Guest|27074 ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
07:53:19 <Guest|27074> hello
07:53:38 <rust_collector> hoi
07:59:29 Quit: Guest|27074 ([email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
08:05:40 Quit: coppice ([email protected]) Connection closed
08:06:00 Join: coppice ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
10:15:04 Quit: coppice ([email protected]) Connection closed
10:15:24 Join: coppice ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
10:44:25 <DHess_US> https://i.imgur.com/yGnmK4E.jpg
11:14:46 <T3sl4> we don't need to see your lube, DHess_US
11:16:00 <DHess_US> Now you know why it is called "long pork".
11:22:16 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: NEW Video on EEVblog2! 13yo Invents a Better Hyperloop - Still a STUPID IDEA https://t.co/EcgCvcAd5a
11:51:28 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: Hyperloop is still bullshit. A 13yo scientist and CNN aren't going to save it: https://t.co/Jt68zwPQCG
12:05:16 <DHess_US> Converted the Storage Spaces parity volume which was giving me so much trouble to a mirror. Now it is time to break it.
12:15:39 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: uBeam, err "SonicEnergy" get more money: https://t.co/II8zvynEbD
12:55:56 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: The evolution of Scientific media... cc @thunderf00t https://t.co/A5nx0LX6aE
14:37:27 Join: Guest|6310 ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
14:39:26 <Guest|6310> Hi, can anyone PLEASSE explain resistor choice for voltage dividers on non inverting single supply op amps? I'm confused as one design specifies two 47k resistors and the other specifies two 2m ohm resistors.
14:40:44 <Guest|6310> have scoured the web searching for answers, but yet again google is useless. does resistor choice on the voltage divider change the input impedance???
14:40:49 <Guest|6310> tia
14:56:28 <Ampera> Forum might be a better place right now.
14:56:32 <Ampera> either that or ask T3sl4 if he's around
14:57:19 <T3sl4> Guest|6310: higher resistance loads the output less
14:57:42 <T3sl4> higher resistance also gives more noise and less bandwidth against the -in pin capacitance
15:13:31 <Guest|6310> so for high gain...higher resistance is desirable...???
15:19:28 <T3sl4> i didn't say anything about gain?
15:28:36 <Guest|6310> oh, I thought the input loads the output through the voltage divider...
15:31:09 <Guest|6310> all the explanations I've read of the variances in resistor values have said that they change the input impedance.
16:31:44 <T3sl4> noninverting only connects an input pin to the signal source
16:32:02 <T3sl4> inverting connects signal source to a virtual ground, and the resistors matter
16:51:08 <Guest|6310> ok, it's too much trouble to figure out non inverting single supply voltage divider resistor differences. I will use an inverting design. or two 9v batteries.
16:51:34 <Guest|6310> the internet is a terrible place to try and learn
16:53:17 <Guest|6310> very frustrating
16:56:30 <Guest|6310> @T3sl4 thanks for helping me. good luck!
16:56:36 Quit: Guest|6310 ([email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
16:58:48 <T3sl4> what do i need good luck for? :P
17:24:13 Quit: ThunderSqueak ([email protected]) Quit: Leaving
17:25:46 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: Getting the gear ready to head out for a shoot. Likely EEVdiscover video. https://t.co/Bh3P5Rr0C0
17:28:16 <DogWomble> the internet can be a great place to learn :D
17:35:27 <damian> it's really good for boobs, too
17:37:14 <DogWomble> i wouldn't know :)
19:21:49 <Halcyon> Evening all
19:22:45 <orbii> hiya halycon
19:22:49 <orbii> damnit, i can type
19:22:55 <orbii> hi halcyon
19:24:14 <Halcyon> :)
19:25:08 <orbii> how goes it?
19:27:22 <Halcyon> Not too bad, although trying to work out why all the NICs on this new server just decided to go down
19:27:39 <Halcyon> Switch reports a link, Proxmox reports link is down
19:32:10 <orbii> that's a bit weird.
19:33:01 <Halcyon> Yep
19:33:20 <Halcyon> 3 different interfaces two. One dual NIC Intel card and one on-board
19:33:31 <Halcyon> Was working fine on the weekend, haven't touched it since
19:33:39 <Halcyon> Even after a reboot it's not coming back up
19:34:56 * DogWomble waves
19:34:57 <Halcyon> I might give this switch a reboot, back shortly
19:35:00 Quit: Halcyon ([email protected]) Quit: Leaving
19:50:05 <DHess_US> Nice NICs don't go down.
19:53:16 <DogWomble> yeah, i simplified my setup at home for this reason, sure i lose the geek factor but i don't have to spend time troubleshooting random crap
19:53:29 <DogWomble> at the moment it's just a computer, a phone, a tablet and a router :)
19:54:27 <DogWomble> my work life is spent troubleshooting people's random crap, i kinda like that my homes setup (mostly) just works
19:59:58 Join: Halcyon ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
19:59:59 Mode: (by ChanOP) +a Halcyon
20:00:06 <Halcyon> Well, looks like one of my switches just died
20:00:13 <Halcyon> Rebooted and didn't want to come back up again
20:16:44 <gremlinz> rip
20:30:29 <Halcyon> Yup
20:30:31 <Halcyon> Really annoying
20:30:39 <Halcyon> Strange failure mode too
20:30:57 <Halcyon> I wonder if its been the root cause of my strange VLAN issues all along
20:38:05 * steve30 collapses onto Halcyon
20:41:25 Join: OITHEREYOUCHEEKY ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
20:41:29 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> OI!
20:41:53 <steve30> Morning
20:41:54 <Halcyon> Oi indeed
20:42:36 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> Im trying to wrangle this wireless arduino right now
20:42:52 <Halcyon> Oh?
20:42:53 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> but Ive got to deal with writing client server code which is a real headache
20:43:03 <Halcyon> Ahh, programming is not my forte :)
20:43:12 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> same lol
20:43:46 <steve30> Halcyon, I have to go out in a bit, but its dull and wet out.
20:44:16 <Halcyon> You fix my switch and I'll go out in the dull and wet for you :P
20:44:40 <steve30> Meow :/
20:44:56 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> Dull and wet, what are you in england
20:45:05 <Halcyon> Hah, he is :P
20:45:08 <Halcyon> How did you guess
20:45:14 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> hahaha
20:45:33 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> Im in seattle, so I can relate
20:45:51 <Halcyon> Oh, that place they "nuke" on WarGames
20:45:52 <Halcyon> :P
20:45:58 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> :/
20:46:16 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> Yeah, theres a navy base that holds nukes pretty close to seattle
20:46:27 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> It does worry me a bit if Im being honest
20:47:06 <Halcyon> You could always come to Australia. We're far enough away from bloody everything
20:47:32 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> Do australians approve of americans though? I don't think Id fit in
20:47:46 <Halcyon> Australian's largely don't give a shit
20:48:03 <Halcyon> As long as you aren't a dickhead, we approve
20:50:15 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> Is it true that buying stuff online is really expensive
20:50:24 <Halcyon> Down here?
20:50:28 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> Yeah
20:50:33 <Halcyon> Not that I know of?
20:51:06 <OITHEREYOUCHEEKY> interesting
20:52:28 <DogWomble> depends where you're buying it from
20:52:53 <DogWomble> oru aussie dollar is a bit variable so that can affect overseas prucahses
20:54:49 <DogWomble> and by variable, i mean not as good an exchange rate as it used to be
21:27:26 * orbii looks about
21:27:57 Quit: DogWomble ([email protected]) Changing hosts
21:27:57 Join: DogWomble ([email protected]) to #EEVblog
21:27:57 Mode: (by lego.jp.austnet.org) +o DogWomble
21:28:24 * Halcyon eyes off orbii's switches :P
21:29:57 <Halcyon> I was wanting to upgrade to 10Gbit, but I didn't want to be forced into buying new gear now
21:30:13 * orbii hides equipment
21:30:26 <Halcyon> :P
21:30:33 * orbii hums innocently
21:31:16 <Halcyon> The sensible me says to just buy another 24 port Gig switch
21:31:20 <orbii> nothing is as it seems.
21:31:26 <orbii> everything is a mystery
21:31:39 <orbii> the equipment you think - isnt
21:31:42 * orbii waves hands
21:31:49 <steve30> I wonder if 'Other courier 3-5 days' will come today
21:33:04 <orbii> probably not
21:33:09 <orbii> the postal system is unreliable at best
21:33:27 <Halcyon> I dunno Orbii, Australia Post is pretty reliable
21:33:32 * orbii blinks a few time
21:33:42 <orbii> well, they're consistently bad - but i dont know about reliable
21:33:48 <Halcyon> Even with regular parcel post, I can have packages sent to Canberra and delivered the next day
21:34:48 <orbii> so many guaranteed 'next day' deliveries in this country have taken 2-3 days
21:35:06 <orbii> it's probably better when it's between close capitals
21:35:24 <orbii> syd-cbr, cbr-mel, syd-bne, etc
21:35:30 <Halcyon> *nod*
21:35:44 <Halcyon> Mind you, I'm in the Blue Mountains. It's still next day to Canberra most of the time.
21:36:06 <Halcyon> I guess it depends on the routes etc...
21:36:11 <Halcyon> No idea how they have it set up
21:36:11 <orbii> i guess
21:36:41 <rust_collector> most places, you might as well go for the regular package, and not the next day option. it is pretty expensive, not much faster, and if you need a thing now, go get it, or have a courier get it for you
21:37:15 <orbii> it *used* to wor.
21:37:30 <orbii> before the govt gutted them, and then pointed at them 'look at how shit they are - we should privatise that'
21:37:58 <orbii> so now almost universally, couriers are better and auspost will end up privatised cos some friend of a politician will end up with massive kickbacks out of it
21:38:00 <rust_collector> it is what the governments do everywhere.
21:38:15 <Halcyon> Yeh if it's that urgent, courier is the best option (or throw an employee into a car)
21:38:37 <orbii> i get tonnes of stuff next day from various companies in .au via couriers
21:39:20 <steve30> I assume my 10/100 equipment is safe from Halcyon.
21:39:26 <orbii> id imagine so
21:39:34 <orbii> i personally wouldnt touch 10/100 with a bargepole
21:39:51 <rust_collector> no, why would you?
21:40:05 <orbii> to push it into a bin, maybe
21:40:37 <rust_collector> if I had a bargepole, I would use it for something more fun than that
21:40:42 <Halcyon> Steve: Don't be so sure
21:40:52 <orbii> pushing a barge?
21:40:55 <Halcyon> I was just lucky I have a stash of 10/100 switches and hubs
21:41:14 <Halcyon> The one I am currently using is POE even
21:41:18 <Halcyon> Handy for CCTV
21:41:28 <steve30> Well, I'm off out. I need shopping.
21:41:37 <Halcyon> Enjoy Steve
21:41:40 * steve30 is running low on coffee
21:44:02 * T3sl4 hugs steve30
21:44:44 Quit: OITHEREYOUCHEEKY ([email protected]) Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
21:47:08 * Halcyon licks Ampera
21:47:18 <orbii> should we worry about ampera?
21:48:33 <Halcyon> A little
21:48:47 <Halcyon> But only because we care
21:48:49 <orbii> just stuff he said earlier, had me a tad concerned
21:48:56 <Halcyon> Yup
21:49:12 <Halcyon> The guy is going through a really shit time
21:50:57 <orbii> i dont at all know what's going on, and i dont feel inclined to pry
21:51:52 <Halcyon> I wish there was an easy answer and resolution, but there isn't.
21:52:00 <orbii> there often is
21:52:09 <orbii> no easy answer, that is
21:52:14 <Halcyon> *nod*
21:52:45 <Halcyon> Aside from his own internal demons, his family life isn't exactly ideal either.
21:53:15 <Halcyon> I will say this, he is a resilient person, more than people people I think.
21:54:05 <Halcyon> *most people
21:56:05 * orbii contemplates replacing soldered wires inside Vectrex with some plugs
21:56:54 <orbii> next person wouldnt need to desolder shit then
21:57:03 <Halcyon> Why fix what's not broke?
21:57:33 <orbii> eh. i'm not averse to what i see are improvements
21:57:48 <orbii> to pull boards out right now you have to desolder them from wires
21:57:51 <Halcyon> True, but perhaps the next person wants to keep it original?
21:58:13 <orbii> the currentowner doesnt seem to care
21:58:18 <Halcyon> :)
21:58:25 <orbii> when i had a potential to have to put a switch on the back, he didnt seem to care
21:58:35 <orbii> but i managed to fix the switch, so wasnt an issue
21:58:46 <Halcyon> Fair enough
22:00:18 <orbii> i mean shit, i'm recapping the entire thing - no original caps :p
22:00:37 <Halcyon> That's unavoidable though
22:00:38 <orbii> you have to remove stickers in some places to even get inside some areas
22:00:57 <Halcyon> What a prick
22:04:07 <orbii> it's very much late 70s/early 80s design
22:04:51 <orbii> funny thing is, the few connectors they have onboard - often fail
22:05:00 <rust_collector> a game thingie?
22:05:11 <orbii> rust_collector: Vectrex
22:05:42 <rust_collector> yes, and that is a game thingie?
22:05:47 <orbii> yes
22:05:53 <orbii> from very early 80s
22:05:56 <rust_collector> ok.
22:06:20 <rust_collector> heh, looks very late 70s
22:06:58 <orbii> crusty MC68A09 inside
22:07:06 <orbii> with like 1KB of memory or something silly
22:07:40 <rust_collector> it says you put plastic sheets on the screen to add color. that is something
22:07:54 <orbii> it sure is.
22:09:43 <orbii> a friend and work collegue of mine had a broken one, and asked me to take a look - knowing im learning repair stuff
22:09:56 <orbii> i've got it working again, but now i'm recapping and giving it a thorough clean, etc.
22:10:14 <rust_collector> nice
22:11:09 <rust_collector> does it have those brown pcbs?
22:17:01 <orbii> ya
22:17:25 <rust_collector> YAAY!
22:17:29 <orbii> and some of the PCB traces are weird. like .. solder but then covered in a thin paint
22:17:39 <orbii> (which is flaking off in some places)
22:20:14 <rust_collector> professional nail polish.
22:21:39 <orbii> it doesnt seem like the sort of PCB stuff you'd get tehse days
22:25:47 <EEVBlog> New EEVBlog Tweet: Upcoming video teaser... https://t.co/hLissb8WfP
22:29:14 <rust_collector> heh, you got the digital drivers license down there too. Oh well
22:30:13 <rust_collector> I think it is a bit weird to have your drivers license as an app on a phone
22:30:59 <orbii> ?
22:31:09 <orbii> where's that?
22:31:14 <rust_collector> NSW
22:31:19 <orbii> havent seen that
22:31:40 <rust_collector> we got it up here in no_way too
22:31:46 <Halcyon> Yeh it was brought out of testing and deployed statewide last week
22:31:49 <rust_collector> I am not sure why
22:32:01 <orbii> halcyon: aint like it's replacing regular ones, so eh
22:32:07 <Halcyon> I don't see the point personally, but each to their own. I know some people no longer have a need for a wallet.
22:32:23 <Halcyon> orbii: The DDL replaces the plastic physical card
22:32:25 <orbii> i dont see the point, either
22:32:35 <orbii> so you cant have both?
22:32:39 <orbii> that's ..
22:32:40 <rust_collector> does it work in all of australiastan?
22:32:40 <orbii> beyond stupid
22:32:42 <Halcyon> Well you *can*
22:33:27 <Halcyon> It's just that the DDL is valid in all circumstances where a physical one would be, including for licenced premises.
22:33:36 <rust_collector> up here, it is only good inside the country, so if you go to "other country, you still need the plastic card
22:33:52 <orbii> wonder how that's gonna go with all the pubs/clubs that want you to insert it into their machines to scan, etc
22:33:57 <Halcyon> That may be true too. Just depends on what the other country is willing to accept.
22:34:14 <Halcyon> orbii: They have QR codes that allow them to be scanned
22:34:21 <orbii> yeah but the scanners only take cards
22:34:30 <Halcyon> It would be manual entry then
22:34:36 <Halcyon> (until they update their gear)
22:34:39 <rust_collector> they would have an app for that
22:34:45 <orbii> either way, wont be partof my life.
22:35:01 <Halcyon> All the machines in pubs and clubs allow for manual entry of information
22:35:24 <Halcyon> As I said, each to their own
22:35:29 * orbii shrug
22:35:38 <Halcyon> I still have to carry a wallet, so there is no point in replacing my traditional licence
22:35:50 <Halcyon> I'm not sure that DDL would work for me as my address is suppressed on RMS
22:35:59 <orbii> how'd you manage that
22:36:06 <Halcyon> Required for work
22:36:09 <orbii> fair enough
22:36:29 <rust_collector> rms?
22:36:38 <Halcyon> Roads and Maritime Services
22:36:41 <orbii> roads and ma.. that
22:36:42 <Halcyon> (AKA the RTA)
22:36:43 <rust_collector> oh
22:37:34 <Halcyon> As I said, I can see merits for some people, but for others, meh.
22:38:00 <orbii> i imagine it would appeal to a lot of younger folk
22:38:03 <orbii> i'm old, i dont care.
22:38:04 <Halcyon> I know you can get digital versions of medicare and various bank/credit cards now
22:38:09 <rust_collector> I just feel a bit weird about it. I am not sure if I like it or not
22:38:12 <Halcyon> But I still carry fuel cards etc...
22:38:53 <Halcyon> At least a bit of plastic doesn't have batteries to worry about
22:39:01 <rust_collector> right
22:39:09 <Halcyon> It's an offence not to keep your phone charged (i.e.: Being able to produce your DDL on demand)
22:39:18 <orbii> i can see a lot of situations where people are gonna get stuck with no license/money cos of no battery on their mobile device
22:39:42 <Halcyon> Yep, well, they should have either (a) kept their phone charged or (b) not bought an iPhone :P
22:39:50 <orbii> do iphones have terrible battery?
22:39:56 <Halcyon> Quite ordinary yes
22:40:02 <orbii> oh okay
22:40:08 <orbii> do androids get several days or a week?
22:40:21 <Halcyon> Only in battery saver modes
22:40:35 <rust_collector> I get about 3 days on my sony
22:40:49 <orbii> Halcyon: im not sure i understand the distinction then :/
22:40:51 <Halcyon> I get a day out of my Samsung S8, but I use it constantly with the LCD on
22:41:24 <Halcyon> orbii: iPhone, you *might* get a day of normal use. Many Android-based phones you could get 1-2 days.
22:41:29 <Halcyon> Nothing like that old Nokia days though
22:41:34 <Halcyon> I miss them
22:41:38 <rust_collector> yeah
22:41:40 <orbii> ...
22:41:44 <orbii> my first mobile phone got about 18 hours.
22:41:47 <orbii> it was a nokia
22:41:56 <orbii> i think ti really depended on the model
22:42:01 <Halcyon> I remember getting a good solid 4+ days from my Nokia 5110
22:42:22 <rust_collector> most nokias would do a 4-5 days
22:42:27 <orbii> and that was mostly just standby, not even use :/
22:42:40 <Halcyon> I still have my original Nokia phones
22:42:48 <Halcyon> Even today, those batteries last the best part of a day
23:04:02 <orbii> it's been a really really long day. i should have already showered and be in bed, and im not
23:04:06 * orbii sighs
23:04:15 <Halcyon> Likewise
23:04:43 <Halcyon> Actually I might do that. I'm basically staring at the screen waiting for VM's to finish backing up.
23:04:50 <Halcyon> I can finish it tomorrow.
23:08:05 <rust_collector> I have coffee...
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