#d&d - 2014-04-24 - AustNet Archive Project

// #d&d — 2014-04-24

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« 2014-04-23 2014-04-25 »
53:45 <Steven> 87
53:45 <s_gmusic> sept. 1987
53:50 <Brunius> huh
14:04 <Steven> need to find 2 traits for this dwarf
14:18 <Brunius> reactionary
14:20 <Brunius> rich parents
14:21 <Brunius> done
15:16 <Steven> nah, rich parents doesnt fit.
15:21 <Steven> my guys been a pirate for years.
15:26 <Steven> well really decades
15:38 <Steven> and reactionary is the backup if i cant find something cooler
16:05 <Yiroep> Sup?
16:13 <Steven> yo
17:50 <Yiroep> I'm like...sick and crap.
17:55 <Yiroep> Yet here I am sitting at work.
18:08 <Brunius> y
18:18 <Yiroep> There's too much to do.
18:35 <Yiroep> I'm not staying the full time today...just enough to get something done.
21:32 <Yiroep> Kinda cool being here at 5 AM, though. I'm actually getting stuff done instead of new employees asking questions 24/7.
23:11 <Brunius> Hey
23:31 <mib_cbu8xh> what.
23:42 <Brunius> Hello
23:53 <mib_cbu8xh> su
23:55 <mib_cbu8xh> p
23:57 <Steven> hmmm shitty equipment traits
24:03 <Brunius> nm
24:07 <Brunius> just sitting here
24:11 <Brunius> music maxed volume
24:25 <Brunius> enjoying the minute or so until my family gets home and I have to set it back to normal volumes
26:25 <Brunius> so what brings you to our fine chatroom, mib_cbu8xh ?
29:35 <Steven> yes please tell us of your motives.
43:15 <mib_cbu8xh> huh
46:48 <Yiroep> I better not be sick for Tomb of the Iron Medusa this weekend.
46:54 <Yiroep> This better go away.
47:15 <Brunius>  Dose up on antibiotics
47:24 <Yiroep> Mmhmm.
47:46 <Yiroep> It's a GM replay, but the table won't make without me.
47:55 <Yiroep> Cause you can't have a level 14 pregen, LOL.L
48:58 <Brunius> I wonder if you can find a plugin to filter messages from specific people containing links to specific sites
49:12 <Brunius> eg stop a certain person in another channel from posting a billion anime photos from imgur
07:49 <Yiroep> Our Tomb party is very martial damage-heavy. No "real" casters. (Well, I'm playing a bard...but he focuses on archery). Never been in a party like that before.
08:00 <Yiroep> Mostly because I'm the one playing the caster, whether arcane or divine.
22:27 <Steven> suuuuuuuup
28:42 <Steven> i remember tomb
29:51 <Yiroep> I do, too. :p
30:14 <Yiroep> I don't think we're gonna fair well, but that's cool. It'll be a challenge.
30:24 * s_gmusic yawns.
30:40 <Steven> it was interesting
30:42 <s_gmusic> Princess Bride watched. Firefly must wait
30:55 <Steven> my life oracle was very decent in the scenario.
31:38 <Yiroep> Mine did too. Summoned a dire shark at one point. Was very hilarious.
37:42 <Steven> i never did get why they put an unholy scythe on the chronicle sheet.
38:00 <Yiroep> I didn't look that closely at it.
38:07 <Yiroep> But I don't remember a scythe anywhere.
38:16 <Yiroep> In the module I mean.
38:22 <Steven> in all of PFS you only ever have a chance to fight a good aligned creature a few times.
38:30 <Steven> and in higher levels you never do.
38:53 <Yiroep> Lol.
38:57 <Yiroep> I know what you are talking about. :p
39:31 <Steven> mebe in the APs there might be some
39:34 <Steven> i havent looked at those.
39:51 <Yiroep> I can only think of three scenarios where you fight good aligned creatures in PFS.
39:58 <Yiroep> And even then, it's only like one battle.
40:40 <Yiroep> Okay just thought of a fourth. And again, one battle.
41:11 <Steven> and all of them are avoidable if memory serves
41:36 <Steven> some of them take some very tricky moves to make it avoidible, but they are
42:04 <Yiroep> Uhh..three of the four that I'm thinking of are. The fourth one would require some crazy planning, but it's possible.
42:48 <Yiroep> aren't*
42:52 <Yiroep> big difference in what I mean.
45:01 <s_gmusic> hm.... thoughts on using a scythe for a character? 2d4 with a 20/x4 crit, has the trip quality, and can deal either piercing or slashing damage. no reach on it and is two-handed melee.
45:33 <Yiroep> I actually think it's a neat weapon, honestly.
45:38 <Steven> my rage prophet uses one.
45:43 <Yiroep> And everyone once in a while, someone gets carved to pieces.
45:58 <Steven> when you do crit its a fight ender usually
46:06 <Steven> lot like a gunslinger
46:39 <Yiroep> Also known to kill low levels in certain scenarios, almost with heavy picks. :p
46:43 <Yiroep> also*
46:48 <Yiroep> Man, I really can't type today.
47:14 <s_gmusic> please don't mention gunslinger crits. I've gotten many a dirty look from being lucky enough to pop 2 crits in a full-round attack as a pistolero >.>
47:30 <s_gmusic> GM wouldn't even let me roll damage, just a "Yep, it's dead."
47:40 <Steven> when buffed up for a fight i think when she crits its like 8d4+80
48:00 <Steven> and her strength isnt close to maxed
48:20 <Yiroep> Meh. My retirement group had a musket master/inquisitor in our party. He did a ton of damage, yes, but I didn't feel it that all that bad.
48:37 <Yiroep> I think it's the most powerful in the 5-9 level range.
48:45 <Steven> yeah my gunquisitor is pretty crazy as well.
50:29 <Yiroep> I still feel wizard and sorcerer are king when it comes to high levels.
50:40 <Yiroep> One failed save and it's done, and there's some easy way to boost saves sky high.
50:54 <Steven> well... my gunquisitor does 4d12+84+2d6
51:00 <Steven> at level 10 on a crit.
51:13 <Steven> so... yeah pretty crazy.
51:57 <Yiroep> ways*
52:17 <Steven> its not hard to get saved decently high.
52:22 <Yiroep> Yeah, it's a lot, but a wizard can end something with 1,000 hp instantly.
53:58 <Steven> the difference between casters ending a fight is that most of their ways to do that usually first have to make it past SR, then a Save, which means you're guaranteed to fail 5% of the time
54:23 <Steven> and unless you've done some ridiculous things to boost your DCs
54:31 <Yiroep> I agree.
54:47 <Yiroep> But a lot of casters do ridiculous things to boost their DCs. :p
54:54 <Steven> they will usually top out at around high 20s low 30s.
55:34 <Steven> and at high level most things you play with will come with a >15
56:45 <Yiroep> Staff of the Master with persistent spell can take care of that.
57:13 <Steven> it makes the chances better.
59:01 <Steven> but lets say your DC is 30, at CR15 their good save is going to be around +18
59:32 <Yiroep> Sure. With persistent, they are likely to fail.
59:43 <Steven> not really
00:03 <Steven> its a dice roll, if they roll two nat 20s they succeed no matter what.
00:08 <Yiroep> Sure.
00:15 <Yiroep> And if you're a gunslinger, 2 nat 1's and you miss.
00:15 <Steven> wizards at high level are variable in their success.
00:18 <Yiroep> What's the difference?
00:43 <Steven> the difference is gunslingers dont have to put their eggs all into one standard action.
00:52 <Steven> and even if they dont crit
00:57 <Steven> they still do something.
01:18 <Steven> most often those save or die spells a wizard will throw out have that pesky (negates)
01:28 <Yiroep> BTW, with +18 and DC 30 and persistent, it's only a 20% chance to succeed the save.
02:52 <Steven> well thats the average CR15 creatures.
03:28 <Steven> doesnt take into account resistances, immunities, SR, or abilities.
03:45 <Steven> like freedom of movement, immune petrification.
04:27 <Yiroep> That's why you prep more than one spell. If they are freedom of movement, you don't cast icy prison. If they don't breathe, you don't cast suffocation....
04:53 <Steven> like if you are a wizard to specializes in battlefield control, and you throw out a DC 35 Persistant Hold Monster on a guy
05:10 <Steven> and its like, well he has freedom of movement
05:22 <Steven> well thats just a complete suck situation.
05:45 <Steven> but a gunslinger unloads 4 attacks.
06:07 <Steven> and if he is worth anything at all he has his pistol as reliable... but lets say he goes 50/50
06:14 <Steven> well he is still doing some damage to the guy.
06:45 <Yiroep> Sure.
06:49 <Yiroep> Fickle Winds.
06:51 <Yiroep> Wind Wall.
06:56 <Yiroep> Displacement.
07:02 <Yiroep> Entropic Shield.
07:48 <Steven> did you know fickle winds and wind wall doesnt actually auto deflect bullets.
07:55 <Steven> only 30%
08:08 <Steven> which is logical, but still funny.
08:42 <Steven> i had a guy get so mad at me when a bad guy cast wind wall and his vital striked furious finish musket shot missed.
09:01 <Steven> told me i was cheating and a son of a bitch.
09:10 <Steven> and it was like... im sorry its int he spell description?
10:49 <Steven> anyways, my point is that wizards arent really anymore powerful then any other class.
10:59 <Steven> other classes usually deal with a static number.
11:13 <Steven> like AC, or CMD.
11:46 <Steven> and to hit scales so much faster than those numbers.
12:29 <s_gmusic> I... didn't have Reliable on my pistolero >.>
12:49 * Steven slaps gmusic
13:06 <Steven> you are a disgrace to gunslingers everywhere!
14:37 <s_gmusic> meh. 'twas my first character in pathfinder. currently lvl 14 and wielding a +4 Planar Pistol of Distance.
15:14 <Steven> ouch.
15:20 <s_gmusic> If I made him all over again, I'd get something else instead of Planar, but that ignore 5 DR of an outsider was kind of nice.
16:00 <Steven> I would have stopped at a +1 and just gotten different kind of bullets
16:16 <s_gmusic> always kept within 30' of my target and Distance let me be as far back as 40'
18:01 <s_gmusic> Martial Artist Monk just hit lvl 5 with 23 Fame (8,000gp limit) and has 13,121gp. keep saving or buy some things?
21:59 <Steven> I'd have gone with a +1 Reliable Seeking Phaselocking Pistol and then saved up to get holy on it.
23:28 <Steven> gmusic do you have a belt of whatever?
23:32 <Steven> if not you should consider getting that.
23:50 <Steven> if you've one of those you should consider a +2 headband of wis
24:55 <s_gmusic> the only money I've spent so far was to buy a temple sword and a Pathfinder kit with my starting gp. haven't spent anything since
26:13 <s_gmusic> also, heard a thing regarding shuriken and monks. should I buy them and keep a small supply on-hand or not worry about it?
12:56 <Yiroep> Cloak of resistance?
13:36 <Yiroep> Cracked Dusty Rose Prism Ioun Stone for Initiative?
15:09 <s_gmusic> wb yiroep
15:17 <Yiroep> Cracked Pale Green Prism Ioun Stone for +1 saves? (Stacks with cloak of resistance)
15:22 <Yiroep> I've been here, just been working. :p
15:26 <s_gmusic> ah, lol
16:19 <Yiroep> I'm a fan of the Tourmaline Ioun Stone for 1k for +2 con for purposes of when you die.
16:25 <s_gmusic> I'd prefer to spend only about half of what I have saved (so no more than 6-7,000gp) total. That should allow me to save back up fast enough to purchase Monks Robes as soon as I have the requisite prestige
16:29 <Yiroep> Although that's not usually the highest on my list.
17:04 <Yiroep> Well, there's plenty of stuff to get. :p
17:08 <Yiroep> That's the point I'm making.
17:26 <Yiroep> My monk is probably going to wait until he can buy a ring of ki storing, but he is a ki-heavy build.
21:36 <s_gmusic> First thing I'd like is a STR belt, then it's picking up a few other things. cloak +1 is 1k, ring of protection +1 is 2k. that would be my 7k limit. could do Bracers of AC +2 instead of the Ring, though.
21:57 <Yiroep> I much prefer a wand of mage armor to bracers of armor.
26:13 <s_gmusic> :|
40:21 Topic for #d&d is: PFS: TBA || WotW: Sat 26th 12pm || SS:Sun 4th 10am || All topic times are AEST (UTC+10:00); set your timezone on the site to see your local times in the Schedule! | Pathfinder Online http://www.pfrpg.com.au
40:21 Topic for #d&d set by Avatar at Sat Apr 12 14:25:26 2014
40:21 <***> Buffer Playback...
40:22 <***> Playback Complete.
41:12 <s_gmusic> before I buy things, gonna level up to 5 first. stuck on my feat options. :(
50:58 <s_gmusic> either Power Attack, Grasping Tail, Panther Claw, Step Up, Tribal Scars, Toughness, or Weapon Focus. >.>
58:38 <s_gmusic> and now I see Crushing Blow. :/
04:58 <s_gmusic> let's see... Power Attack is a melee character staple feat. Grasping Tail is meh since I'm not a caster. Panther Claw grants more uses of Panther Style, but don't think I'd be able to really abuse it, so I may retrain Panther Style into something else. Toughness vs Tribal Scars is an incremental 12 hp over the character's life against a static +6 and an additional bonus, usually save-related. 
04:59 <s_gmusic> Weapon Focus opens up Weapon Specialization for me later since I can take fighter feats but that's 2 feats for +1 to-hit and +2 damage. Crushing Blow depends on using a Full-round action (why not flurry instead) and only works if they fail their Fort save against the Stunning effect.
05:24 <s_gmusic> cuts the list down to either Power Attack or Tribal Scars.
10:55 <Yiroep> Starting to not feel good again. Maybe I'll go home and come back to work later after a nap, lol.
11:03 <Yiroep> I have been here for 4 hours now...
11:27 <Yiroep> Can't say I'm not trying.
12:23 <s_gmusic> what do you do?
13:00 <Mekkis> Judgement Subdomain seems... exploitable
13:04 <Mekkis> !spell mark of justice
13:08 <diebot> Mekkis, MARK OF JUSTICE necromancy ([curse]) cleric 5, paladin 4, witch 5, inquisitor 5 10 minutes Range: touch creature touched Comp: V, S, DF Duration: permanent; see text Save: none SR:yesSource: PFRPG Core
13:08 <diebot> You mark a subject and state some behavior on the part of the subject that will activate the mark. When activated, the mark curses the subject. Typically, you designate some sort of undesirable behavior that activates the mark, but you can pick any act you please. The effect of the mark is identical with the effect of bestow curse. Since this spell
13:09 <diebot> takes 10 minutes to cast and involves writing on the target, you can cast it only on a creature that is willing or restrained. Like the effect of bestow curse, a mark of justice cannot be dispelled, but it can be removed with a break enchantment, limited wish, miracle, remove curse, or wish spell. Remove curse works only if its caster level is
13:09 <diebot> equal to or higher than your mark of justice caster level. These restrictions apply regardless of whether the mark has activated.
14:35 <Yiroep> I'm an engineer.
14:50 <s_gmusic> ah
15:05 <s_gmusic> mechanical or electrical?
15:12 <Yiroep> I do a lot of energy-type stuff like analyzing building's energy usage and performing savings calculations.
15:21 <Yiroep> My degree is mechanical.
15:56 <Yiroep> But really an "energy engineer" is a more accurate title.
16:57 <s_gmusic> adamantine swordbreaker dagger = sunder bitch
21:38 <andrey> does anyone else think sorcerers should get 4 skill ranks per level?
21:49 <Mekkis> yes
26:40 <andrey> has anyone talked to paizo about it?
26:56 <Mekkis> I talked to Buhlman about it
28:16 <Brunius> We haven't seen noseveins/angryarab/genericotherspam recently, have we?
28:31 <Brunius> Just occured to me that I don't think I've seen him since I got back
28:36 <Mekkis> last night
05:18 <Mekkis> <ahmedd> [15:52:40] EUZUBILLAHIMINEÞÞEYTANIRRACIM BISMILLAHIRRAHMANIRRAHIM
07:14 <andrey> that's what buhlman said?
07:38 <Mekkis> andrey, I don't actually remember his response
08:23 <andrey> ballpark estimate?
10:46 <s_gmusic> rawrg. can't find many ways to increase the DC of my Stunning Fist aside from a style feat and increasing WIS. :(
13:14 <Mekkis> "We didn't want to rock the boat too much from 3.5"
18:40 TheHolyGrail ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
18:40 ChanOP has kicked TheHolyGrail from #d&d ((Ballig) Probably a spammer, message Ballig otherwise.)
01:19 * Brunius sets ban on *!TheRoyals@*
14:19 <Mekkis> hmm
14:51 <Mekkis> Deeds: Swashbucklers spend panache points to
14:51 <Mekkis> accomplish deeds. Most deeds grant the swashbuckler
14:51 <Mekkis> a monetary bonus or effect, but some provide longer-
14:51 <Mekkis> lasting effects. 
36:18 <andrey> can you use money to get panache?
37:23 <Mekkis> I suppose so
37:57 <andrey> resulting in endless feedback loop?
39:54 <Mekkis> I think the "deed" format is stupid. They're just additional class features.
09:16 <Mekkis> andrey, can you suggest items for my summoner?
09:32 <andrey> I'm not your man sorry
09:39 <andrey> never played one
09:48 <andrey> maybe avatar?
09:53 <andrey> avatar
10:13 <Mekkis> he's at work
11:25 <Mekkis> I think I'll just blow it on a bunch of interesting items
11:36 <s_gmusic> but I'm not. managed to close up early.
11:55 <Mekkis> wow. You did!
12:57 <Mekkis> !item Armbands Of The Brawler
12:59 <diebot> Mekkis, ARMBANDS OF THE BRAWLER [faint transmutation] CL:3 wrists 500gp, 1lb
13:00 <diebot> These scarred and worn armbands have clearly seen rough use, and are constructed out of coarse leather and fastened with thick leather straps. They grant their wearer a +1 competence bonus on grapple checks and checks to break a grapple. Source: Ultimate Equipment
13:03 <s_gmusic> now I get to find something to do...
13:17 <s_gmusic> could sleep. or start back on planning my Living Monolith.
14:05 <Mekkis> !item Ring Of Arcane Signets
14:06 <diebot> Mekkis, RING OF ARCANE SIGNETS [faint universal] CL:8 ring 1000gp, 0lb
14:06 <diebot> The approximately 1-inch-diameter pentagon of emerald green crystal that dominates this otherwise plain silver ring forms itself into a specific rune, sigil, or similar identifying marker each time a person first puts it on. If the wearer expects this to occur, she can cause the crystal to adopt any shape she wishes. If the wearer does not expect
14:06 <diebot> this to occur, the crystal instead molds itself into an image that symbolizes the wearer or some dominant facet of her personality. Once the crystal assumes this initial form, it always takes that form whenever the same wearer puts on the ring. The wearer can, as a standard action, embed this image on any object (as if using arcane mark) simply by
14:06 <diebot> pressing the ring against it. The wearer may choose the color and other cosmetic features of the image each time she uses the ring. The brand is otherwise permanent unless removed by dispel magic, erase, or a more powerful spell. Source: Ultimate Equipment
14:40 <Mekkis> !item Tengu Drinking Jug
14:41 <diebot> Mekkis, TENGU DRINKING JUG [faint transmutation] CL:3 none 1000gp, 2lb
14:42 <diebot> This looks like a one-gallon stoneware jug with white glaze, black birds painted around the middle, and a cork stopper tied about the neck with a hemp cord. Any liquid placed within the jug becomes safe to drink, as though affected by purify food and drink (though the jug only affects liquids). Three times per day, the bearer can command the jug to
14:42 <diebot> alter the temperature of its contents so that it ranges anywhere from ice cold to boiling hot. Once per day, the bearer can command water placed into the jug to transform into plum liquor, sake, or tea. A tengu jug holds up to 1 gallon of any liquid. Source: Advanced Race Guide
15:15 <Mekkis> !item Solidsmoke Pipeweed
15:17 <diebot> Mekkis, SOLIDSMOKE PIPEWEED [moderate conjuration] CL:7 none 1000gp, 0lb
15:17 <diebot> The description is too long to send over IRC. View http://nl.ti4200.info/vpsirc/items/solidsmoke_pipeweed.html
16:04 <Mekkis> pity I'm no halfling
17:09 <Mekkis> !item Daredevil Boots
17:10 <diebot> Mekkis, DAREDEVIL BOOTS [faint enchantment] CL:3 feet 1400gp, 1lb
17:10 <diebot> This pair of magical boots shimmers in vibrant shades of blazing red and burning orange when they are held up to the light. These boots allow the wearer to gain extra maneuverability while moving through hazardous areas. As a free action, the wearer can click her heels together to grant herself a +5 competence bonus on Acrobatics checks made to
17:10 <diebot> move through threatened squares or to move through an enemy's space without provoking attacks of opportunity for up to 10 rounds per day. The rounds do not need to be consecutive. Furthermore, anytime the wearer of the boots successfully moves though the space of an enemy without provoking an attack of opportunity, she gains a +1 bonus on attack
17:10 <diebot> rolls against that enemy until the end of her turn. Source: Ultimate Equipment
17:29 <Mekkis> nice
19:35 <s_gmusic> Daredevil Boots + Quick Runner's Shirt
23:01 <Mekkis> Okay, I'm getting a Figurine of Wondrous Power (silver raven)
28:03 <s_gmusic> oh?
29:22 <andrey> so, the metamagic adept bloodline power lets you power items with spellslots
29:32 <andrey> effectively giving you 90 item charges per day
29:45 <Mekkis> ummm... link?
30:00 <andrey> http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/bloodlines/bloodlines-from-paizo/arcane-bloodline
30:03 <Mekkis> s_gmusic, yeah. I'm all over trying to get powerful items for my character.
30:30 <Mekkis> nope
31:02 <Mekkis> well.. yes, but only at 20th level
31:27 <Mekkis> and hell, no idea what happens at 20th
31:31 <andrey> better than most other capstone abilities imo
31:48 <Mekkis> never seen any of them in play
33:03 Mekkis sets mode -R Mekkis
37:35 cYbR ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
39:03 <andrey> ok
39:19 <andrey> so, does the shatter spell automatically destroy solid objects
39:25 <Mekkis> !spell shatter
39:26 <diebot> Mekkis, SHATTER evocation ([sonic]) bard 2, cleric 2, sorcerer/wizard 2, magus 2 1 standard action Range: close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) 5-ft.-radius spread; or one solid object or one crystalline creature Comp: V, S, M/DF (a chip of mica) Duration: instantaneous Save: Will negates (object); Will negates (object) or Fortitude half; see text
39:26 <andrey> like say swords
39:27 <diebot> SR:yesSource: PFRPG Core
39:27 <diebot> Shatter creates a loud, ringing noise that breaks brittle, nonmagical objects; sunders a single solid, nonmagical object; or damages a crystalline creature. Used as an area attack, shatter destroys nonmagical objects of crystal, glass, ceramic, or porcelain. All such objects within a 5-foot radius of the point of origin are smashed into dozens of
39:27 <diebot> pieces by the spell. Objects weighing more than 1 pound per your level are not affected, but all other objects of the appropriate composition are shattered. Alternatively, you can target shatter against a single solid nonmagical object, regardless of composition, weighing up to 10 pounds per caster level. Targeted against a crystalline creature (of
39:27 <diebot> any weight), shatter deals 1d6 points of sonic damage per caster level (maximum 10d6), with a Fortitude save for half damage.
40:09 <Mekkis> andrey, Will negates, if the object is attended.
40:10 <andrey> !spell break
40:10 <diebot> andrey, BREAK transmutation ([]) sorcerer/wizard 1 1 standard action Range: close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) one Medium or smaller object Comp: V, S, M (a twig) Duration: instantaneous Save: Fortitude negates (object) SR:yes (object)Source: APG
40:11 <diebot> You can attempt to break or at least damage any one Medium or smaller object within range. If the target fails its Fortitude saving throw, it gains the broken condition. If cast on a broken item, that item is destroyed on a failed save.
40:22 <Mekkis> Does not work if the object is magical
40:52 <andrey> huh?
41:03 <Mekkis> breaks brittle, nonmagical objects;
41:14 <Mekkis>  Objects weighing more than 1 pound per your level are not affected
41:46 <andrey> I'm not concerned about breaking lots of teacups
41:55 <andrey> more concerned about breaking the big hammer
41:57 <Mekkis> you want to destroy enemy sword.
42:11 <Mekkis> Well, if it's nonmagical, but attended, the wielder gets a will save to prevent it.
42:34 <andrey> ok, most ogres I meet have crap will saves
42:54 <Mekkis> consider &pilfering hand
43:05 <diebot> PILFERING HAND evocation ([force]) bard 2, cleric 2, magus 2, sorcerer/wizard 2 1 standard action Range: close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) one object Comp: S Duration: see text Save: none SR:yes (object)
43:05 <diebot> The description is too long to send over IRC. View http://nl.ti4200.info/vpsirc/spells/pilfering_hand.html
44:28 <andrey> most ogres have good CMDs
44:45 <Mekkis> true.
45:01 cYbR ([email protected]) has left #d&d (Leaving)
47:22 <s_gmusic> wait, mekkis. I though that if an object was attended, then the only thing about it is that the item uses the holder's saves bonuses for its own.
48:25 <andrey> well yes
48:55 <andrey> that's why shatter seems so good for breaking weapons
49:08 <andrey> of unwise people
49:11 <s_gmusic> nvm
49:28 <s_gmusic> were saying the same thing, just worded differently
49:43 <s_gmusic> that screws me up a lot. :|
59:06 dicebot has quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
02:57 dicebot ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
12:41 <s_gmusic> y'know....
12:50 <s_gmusic> after reading over even more things
13:09 <s_gmusic> I think video games have ruined me when it comes to magic.
13:12 <s_gmusic> :(
15:06 <Brunius> y
16:46 <s_gmusic> just an odd feeling I get as I try to think up a caster
39:43 <andrey> so, I'm confused
40:08 <Steven> good good.
40:11 <andrey> if I cast a touch spell, make the touch attack, miss, where does it say the spell is wasted
40:30 <andrey> the prd seems to indicate I retain the charge until I hit something
40:31 <Steven> its not
40:44 <andrey> nice
40:47 <Yiroep> If it's a melee touch spell, it's still on your hand.
42:02 <andrey> that makes it a lot more viable
42:41 <Yiroep> Mmhmm.
55:53 <Mekkis> s_gmusic, what video games have you been playing?
58:20 <s_gmusic> nothing in the past couple months. been trying to avoid playing them for a bit
59:53 <Mekkis> most video games' magic systems are pretty scripted.
07:03 <Mekkis> sure, they can simulate a fireball
37:45 Steven ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
52:14 <andrey> but they can't do metamagic?
52:27 <andrey> for example I like the magic system in crawl
52:40 <ahmedd> EUZUBILLAHIMINEÞÞEYTANIRRACIM BISMILLAHIRRAHMANIRRAHIM
52:41 <ahmedd> ALLAHU EKBERRRRR! LA ÝLAHE ÝLLALLAH MUHAMMEDEN RESULULLAH!
52:41 <ahmedd> I did the obligatory prayers five times a day to the nation. And I promised myself that, who (beside me) taking care not to make the five daily prayers comes ahead of time, I'll put it to heaven. Who says prayer does not show attention to me I do not have a word for it.! Prophet Muhammad (s.a.v.)
52:41 <ahmedd> hell if you did until the needle tip could not remove your head from prostration Prophet Muhammad pbuh
57:12 <Steven> i made bangers and mash.
03:39 <Steven> it was tasty
03:42 <Steven> so what we doin?
09:53 <s_gmusic> reading
25:56 <Steven> me too, im reading p2 of eyes
31:31 <Mekkis> andrey, they can't do a lot of things. Pretty much anything that's nonoffensive
32:01 <andrey> the translocations and charms school beg to differ
32:14 <andrey> *schools
32:57 <andrey> divination was removed because it was deemed cheesy and unfun
33:11 <andrey> the effects got shunted into a new god
40:35 <Avatar> how has it ruined it for you if you're not playing them
53:34 <andrey> hmm
53:42 <andrey> nothing has been ruined
53:52 <andrey> except swiftness
53:56 <andrey> ruined forever
54:00 <andrey> my fav spell
54:10 <andrey> anyway, question about empower spell
54:25 <andrey> if a spell does 1d6 damage, does empower just add +3 to damage?
54:33 <andrey> or does it depend on what you roll?
55:19 <Steven> depends on what you roll
58:07 <Avatar> are s_g and andrey the same person
58:22 <andrey> ok so i did math
58:32 <andrey> say you have 9th level spell slot
59:33 <andrey> you can use it to cast meteor swarm which in best case does 24d6 fire + 8d6 bludgeoning damage
59:51 <andrey> best case scenario they take 192 damage
00:34 <andrey> or you could paralyze the enemy somehow so they can't make their save and cast metamagic fireball
01:00 <andrey> empowered maximized intensified fireball takes a 9th level spell slot
01:06 <andrey> and does guaranteed 270 damage
02:20 <andrey> wait no
02:24 <andrey> i math'd wrong
04:49 <Mekkis> andrey, I mean, computer games generally can't do them.
05:12 <andrey> crawl can
05:16 <andrey> deus ex can
05:48 <Mekkis> regarding empower: if a fireball does 10d6, an empower fireball will do 10d6 * 1.5.
06:05 <andrey> yes
06:18 <andrey> comes out to 135 guaranteed damage
06:26 <Mekkis> ummm. no
06:50 <andrey> pretty crap for a 9th level spell
07:10 <Mekkis> empowered maximised 10d6 fireball does 60+ 10d6*0.5 damage
07:48 <andrey> so not even 135 guaranteed
07:55 <andrey> wow metamagic sucks
08:24 <Steven> on a fireball... yeah.
10:10 <Brunius> i wanna play some pathfinder
10:40 <Steven> on like a maximized Enervation... its not bad.
11:12 <Steven> auto 4 neg levels, -4 to hit saves and skill checks and -20maxHP, pretty good debuff.
12:23 <andrey> my build revolves around metamagic and fireballs
12:48 <andrey> the future looks bleak now
13:30 <Steven> why would you do that?
13:53 <Steven> at higher levels fire is the lease useful damage type to do.
14:15 <andrey> yes, I am going to make air elementalist next
14:26 <andrey> at least I will be able to do irresistible damage
14:28 <andrey> oh wait
16:11 <Steven> sonic damage man... do it up.
16:51 <andrey> yes sonic+bludgeoning
17:26 <Steven> i've got to make another character.
17:32 <Steven> i'm running out of lower end things.
23:43 Gamera ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
27:25 <andrey> air+sonic kind of work together in terms of flavor
27:45 <andrey> you think?
28:28 <Steven> meh
29:20 <andrey> sonic damage is bard territory :)
35:00 <andrey> ohh
35:00 <andrey> metamagic rods are indefinite use
37:09 <andrey> that's why prepared casters are so good
38:37 <andrey> can you use arcane sorcerer's metamagic thingy with rods?
39:37 <andrey> the one that lets you decrease casting time for metamagic?
41:17 <Steven> metamagic rods are 3 use per day items.
42:12 <andrey> arcane bloodline
42:25 <Steven> well, im goin to sleep.  today has sucked and theres no reason to drag it out.
42:25 <andrey> metamagic adept power
42:48 <andrey> good night steven :)
43:04 <andrey> hope tomorrow is better
43:25 Ulzef ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
43:34 <Ulzef> hey people
43:49 <Ulzef> does any7one have inner sea gods on PDF yuet?
49:23 <Ulzef> *chirp**chirp*
49:40 <andrey> no
54:35 <Ulzef> also men t to the hi people
54:46 <Brunius|M> Hi
00:33 <Ulzef> yeah its up for general pdf on the 30th and buying it then figured someone might have a sub and wanted to look at one of the classes before meks game
23:40 bendog has quit (Connection closed)
27:08 bendog ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
24:36 <Mekkis> Ulzef, nope. 
24:43 <Mekkis> Not sure if I'll buy it
30:31 <Ulzef> oh you will at least get the class 
30:45 <Mekkis> ?
40:24 <Ulzef> the is a prestige that by the preview would be awesome for my oracle in yopur game
53:51 <Mekkis> logged into diebot.ti4200.info, as root
54:13 <Mekkis> "Last login: Fri Dec 30 10:15:56 EST 2011 on tty1."
02:59 <Mekkis> Ulzef, I thought you had a subscription
27:15 <Ulzef> i do but not to setting\
27:34 <Mekkis> ah
27:39 <Ulzef> sub to all the book line cept it and hardcovers
41:49 <Mekkis> heh
45:45 <Mekkis> how much UMD should Riddywipple get? Is +28 sufficient?
46:39 <Mekkis> +28 means that using Breath of Life won't be an issue again.
52:01 <Mekkis> how does retraining work?
44:39 <Ulzef> no idea
45:03 <Ulzef> and brad said he messaged you on tuesday and was waiting to hear back
49:30 Yiroep ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
51:13 <Avatar> do you have the book ulzef
51:23 <Mekkis> Ulzef, I did respond
51:40 <Avatar> what do you need to know about retraining
51:47 <Avatar> I am the retraining master
52:39 <Mekkis> ok
53:08 <Mekkis> Say I play a tiefling, and go wizard 1 / druid 2, then take a level of mystic theurge.
53:19 <Mekkis> Can I the retrain the wizard level into druid.
53:44 <Avatar> I don't think you qualify for your mystic theurge levels if you do
53:55 <Avatar> there's a similar thing about that for feats
54:31 <Mekkis> but the level of wizard doesn't help me qualify for the MT levels
54:46 <Mekkis> it just specified what the "existing arcane spellcasting class" is
55:13 <Avatar> but you won't have an existing arcane spellcasting class
55:34 <Mekkis> yes I will. Mystic Theurge :S
55:48 <Avatar> mystic theurge isn't a pre-requestite for itself
56:03 <Avatar> there is a more recent FAQ about it
56:14 <Avatar> they did some fairly serious banning with prestige class retraining
56:21 <Mekkis> having an arcane spellcasting class isn't a prereq
56:38 <Avatar> what are the pre-reqs
56:55 <Mekkis> 3 ranks knowledge religion
57:01 <Mekkis> 3 ranks knowledge arcana
57:10 <Mekkis> ability to cast 2nd level arcane spells
57:17 <Mekkis> ability to cast 2nd level divine spells
57:34 <Avatar> how did you have the ability to cast 2nd level arcane spells with wizard 1
57:46 <Mekkis> by being a tiefling
57:51 <Mekkis> they have the darkness SLA
57:58 <Mekkis> which is considered level 2 arcane
58:00 <Avatar> okay well if you retrain that level, you no longer have that ability
58:14 <Mekkis> ?
58:31 <Avatar> the pre-req is gone for the purposes of taking the mystic theurge levels
58:38 <Mekkis> what prereq?
58:45 <Avatar> the ability to cast 2nd level arcane spells
58:50 <Avatar> it can't come from the prestige class
59:03 <Mekkis> it's not coming from any base class
59:07 <Mekkis> it's coming from the race
59:11 <Yiroep> Why would you want to do that Mekkis?
59:15 <Avatar> even without wizard 1?
59:18 <Mekkis> yep
59:22 <Yiroep> There's no point in being a theurge at that point. You have no arcane casting at all.
59:32 <Yiroep> Yes, mystic theurge raises it, but there's nothing to raise.
59:54 <Avatar> that might be alright then?
00:15 <Yiroep> Sure, if you want to be a full caster druid with no benefits from actually being a druid. :p
00:20 <Mekkis> What if I retrained the wizard 1 to witch 1
00:33 <Yiroep> That may work.
00:42 <Mekkis> do I suddenly get spellcasting as if I were a level N+1 witch?
00:52 <Avatar> if the prestige class has nothing to do with wizard 1, why wouldn't you be able to
01:02 <Avatar> I thought that was the block
01:17 <Yiroep> I'm not entirely sure, though. Is there any precedence for it?
01:46 <Avatar> you should
02:45 <Avatar> http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1gn
02:52 <Yiroep> Yeah, unless there's something that says otherwise, I'd say it works.
02:54 <Avatar> that has the two FAQs you have to be mindful of when doing funky retraining
03:21 <Ulzef> ended up getting the books
03:32 <Ulzef> the class i was after does notr help
04:04 <Ulzef> nice feat for deceased though you can use int instead of cha for diplo
04:32 <Avatar> trait?
05:10 <Ulzef> nah feat
05:37 <Mekkis> Avatar, that FAQ just says: no base class -> prestige class retraining
05:45 <Mekkis> I'm not trying that
05:48 <Avatar> yeah and you sound fine there
06:03 <Avatar> anything else seems kosher
06:09 <Mekkis> I'm arguing that the level of Mystic Theurge gives you +1 druid level, and +1 wizard level.
06:24 <Ulzef> nope
06:33 <Ulzef> base class requires base class to add to
06:37 <Mekkis> and as such, if you later retrain the base level of wizard to something that isn't wizard, it remains.
07:05 <Avatar> +1 divine and +1 arcane isn't it
07:24 <Avatar> how would it work if you levelled up and multiclassed into witch
07:28 <Avatar> alongside wizard and druid
07:32 <Mekkis> ahh...
07:39 <Mekkis> what about this bit:
07:53 <Mekkis> So, druid 1, wizard 1, witch 1, mystic theurge 1.
08:01 <Mekkis> When you take the mystic theurge level:
08:16 <Mekkis> If a character had more than one arcane
08:16 <Mekkis> spellcasting class or more than one divine spellcasting
08:16 <Mekkis> class before he became a mystic theurge, he must decide
08:16 <Mekkis> to which class he adds each level of mystic theurge for
08:16 <Mekkis> the purpose of determining spells per day.
08:38 <Avatar> you'd have to retrain the class feature I think
08:56 <Mekkis> so If I named Wizard, then retrained the wizard level...
09:14 <Avatar> then you'd just have a dead ability
09:57 <Mekkis> hmmm...
10:02 <Mekkis> what about this...
10:20 <Mekkis> wizard 1 / cleric 1 / balanced scale of abadar 1 / mystic theurge 1.
10:37 <Mekkis> Could I then retrain the Balanced Scale of abadar level into mystic theurge?
10:55 <Avatar> no idea what balanced scale is
11:05 <Avatar> do you need it to meet the pre-reqs for mystic
11:11 <Mekkis> nope
11:15 <Avatar> then yes
11:20 <Avatar> why wouldn't you
11:27 <Mekkis> you do need three ranks in the requesite knowledges...
11:44 <Avatar> do you have the skill points
11:54 <Avatar> that should still be fine
12:14 <Mekkis> so after retraining, you'd have wizard 1 / cleric 1 / mystic theurge 2?
15:03 <Yiroep> You can't retrain base class levels for prestige class levels. It's in the FAQ.
15:15 <Mekkis> Yiroep, I'm not proposing that
15:16 <Yiroep> Hrm.
15:18 <Yiroep> Oh I see.
16:30 <Yiroep> I would argue that you couldn't because you can't qualify for MT without the MT levels itself. As a level 2, you can't have 3 ranks in something.
16:46 <Yiroep> I would say that it would fall under the 2nd FAQ of the retraining.
19:49 <Mekkis> perhaps
20:31 <Mekkis> skill points aren't 'rule elements of a prestige class'
24:19 <Avatar> oh
24:28 <Avatar> yeah you need 3 classes before you get mystic theurge
24:41 <Avatar> so you can't retrain where you only have 2 other classes that could get those 3 skill points
31:05 <Mekkis> So
31:32 <Mekkis> say you started by taking a level of cleric, with 1 rank in Know (religion) and another in Know (arcana).
31:59 <Mekkis> then you took a level of Balanced Scale of Abadar, and did not put any ranks in knowledges
32:22 <Mekkis> then, you took a level of wizard, putting an additional two ranks into knowledge (religion) and arcana.
32:48 <Mekkis> you have three ranks in each skill you need, and none of them are based of the level of Balanced Scale you took
33:06 <Yiroep> That's kind of fishing deep there. :p
33:14 <Yiroep> I would just ask on the boards.
33:23 <Avatar> yeah but you can't have a combination where you can have 2 levels of mystic and 2 levels of other things and 3 ranks before you hit mystic
33:37 <Avatar> if you can't do that combination, it fails
33:51 <Mekkis> but that's not specified anywhere in the rules or FAQ
33:51 <Avatar> if you had some way of doing 3 ranks with 2 levels, then it's fine
34:33 <Mekkis> just that "you cannot use rule elements from a prestige class to meet the requirements of that prestige class."
34:43 <Mekkis> I'm not using any Rule Elements to do that.
34:58 <Avatar>  If retraining a 
34:59 <Avatar> class level means you no longer qualify for a feat, prestige 
34:59 <Avatar> class, or other ability you have, you can’t use that feat, 
34:59 <Avatar> prestige class, or ability until you meet the qualif ications 
34:59 <Avatar> again.
35:00 <Mekkis> All skill points were assigned during the base levels
35:07 <Mekkis> I'm not using any of the,
35:09 <Mekkis> them
36:20 <Mekkis> And I do meet the qualifications
36:58 <Avatar> you don't meet them if you had to get a level of mystic theurge before you could meet them
37:50 <Mekkis> If they meant to say "Your resulting character must have been possible to attain without retraining", they would have said that.
38:05 <Avatar> they basically did
38:09 <Avatar> in both that paragraph and the FAQ
38:09 <Mekkis> they didn't
38:36 <Avatar> if you're looking for exact wording on every exact rule and loophole in the game, then you can do most of what you want
38:36 <Mekkis> they just put stipulations preventing about 90% of scenarios that would result in that
39:30 <Mekkis> Irregardless, I think that the retraining rules are stupid, and help the wrong people
40:08 <Avatar> what
41:19 <Mekkis> they don't help the people who really need it: people with incorrectly-built characters who've died once or twice as a result
43:41 <Avatar> I assure you they do
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