// #d&d — 2016-02-16
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00:00:43 <Avatar> photos
00:00:50 <aidrocsid> k
00:14:50 <steven> I got vishkanya boon
00:16:28 <aidrocsid> imgur is being disagreeable
00:22:32 <Avatar> a likely story
00:22:41 <aidrocsid> you can see what i have so far
00:23:03 <aidrocsid> i had to put one on google drive for some reason
00:23:47 <aidrocsid> wow 2 even
00:23:48 <aidrocsid> fuck imgur
00:25:24 <aidrocsid> http://imgur.com/4HnxrK7
00:25:24 <aidrocsid> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8GqDeYqWv15YnUtSmtWelRZcWc/view?usp=sharing
00:25:25 <aidrocsid> http://i.imgur.com/zEGU3q1.jpg
00:25:25 <aidrocsid> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8GqDeYqWv15UzRTSG9FMXA4V00/view?usp=sharing
00:25:25 <aidrocsid> http://i.imgur.com/fE71H0L.jpg
00:25:47 <aidrocsid> that first one is in a few sections too
00:29:56 <aidrocsid> a couple of the wobbly cave ones aren't exact to what's in the book because they're just caves and i didn't care
00:37:30 <aidrocsid> don't look at the pictures or anything avatar jeez :(
00:50:30 <aidrocsid> was that a pun
01:14:39 <Avatar> mate
01:41:01 <heathwool> So still trying to figure out how this works
01:41:25 <heathwool> can someone explain it further?
01:59:56 <Mekkis> aidrocsid, have you seen the ones I've done?
02:04:21 <Mekkis> http://nl.ti4200.info/~mekkis/IMG_1811.JPG
03:48:51 <Avatar> still trying to figure out how this works, can anyone explain it in the next 5 minutes ?
03:48:55 <Avatar> or else I'm leaving
03:49:33 <Ballig> 6 minutes
04:16:27 <steven> nap was good
04:38:19 <Mekkis> !hp 10d8m1
04:38:20 <diebot> Mekkis, 63
05:44:40 <Ballig> annoys the hell out of me when I play casual mode in hearthstone and get pitted against decks chock-full of legendary cards
05:50:57 <Avatar> basically like when you played me after I bought a deck
05:51:04 <Ballig> not at all like that
05:51:16 <Avatar> like the one time I was able to beat you
05:51:23 <Avatar> because of my paid-for deck
05:52:00 <Ballig> your deck was nothing in compared to these decks
05:52:22 <Ballig> after complaining about it, my next opponent played two epics/rares (forget what they are) and a legendary within the first three rounds
05:54:38 <Ballig> pretty sure casual has a ranking system that you can't see, because I was going fine for about a week and now I win maybe 1 in 5 because of all the ridiculous decks I'm up against
05:56:48 <Ballig> Hearthstone uses separate MMRs for different types of play, such as Casual Play mode, Legend-level Ranked play, and non-cooperative Tavern Brawls.[4][1] Each MMR is determined independently and does not affect other types of play. MMRs are 'hidden' and cannot be viewed by players.
05:56:53 <Ballig> look at that
05:58:52 <Mekkis> steven, question
05:59:19 <steven> Mekkis, Misleading answer
05:59:41 <Mekkis> Heh
05:59:59 <Mekkis> How do you adjudicate Polymorph Any Object.
06:00:23 <Mekkis> One of my players wants to polymorph his pseudodragon familiar into an ancient dragon.
06:14:52 <steven> polymorph any object has specific restrictions.
06:15:45 <steven> it states it functions as greater polymorph.
06:17:01 <steven> so when used on creature they can polymorph into anything allowed by beasthape 4, elemental body 3, plant shape 2, and form of the dragon 1
06:17:25 <steven> the main difference between the spells is duration.
06:20:18 <Ballig> I would say that it would act like form of the dragon
06:21:19 <Ballig> the first line of polymorph any object is "this spell functions like greater polymorph", and the only exception seems to be that your target can be an object instead of a creature
06:21:24 <Ballig> otherwise I'd say it should be greater polymorph
06:24:05 <Mekkis> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9oU7rfb-do
06:24:37 <Mekkis> Ah. Got it
06:25:16 <Mekkis> So by polymorph any object, they mean: Polymorph: from Any Object, to Anything that Greater Polymorph allows. Right?
06:26:33 <Ballig> I wouldn't go that far, because it then goes on to talk about what happens when you transform it into another object
06:26:56 <Ballig> I would say it's polymorph: from an object or a creature, to: a creature (as greater polymorph) or another object
06:27:36 <Ballig> based on only a few minutes' consideration, I would be leaning towards treating it as greater polymorph if it meets the conditions of greater polymorph, then looking at the flexibility inherent in the text if it doesn't
06:28:26 <Ballig> with perhaps the duration change if it meets greater polymorph, in order to account for it being a higher level spell
06:29:22 <Ballig> maybe not though, it's a pretty huge difference between 1 minute/level and week/permanent
06:31:43 <Mekkis> yeah, makes sense
06:32:36 <Ballig> the question becomes, I think, "why is it a higher level?" and I would go so far as to say it's because of the convenience of diversity for the situation
06:33:02 <Mekkis> oh, it's definitely valid being a higher level.
06:33:02 <Ballig> greater polymorph is level 7 and lets you use the spell as though it's one of several level 6 spells, and polymorph any object is level 8 and lets you use it as though it's a more diverse form of a level 7 spell
06:33:39 <steven> It is polymorph from any object to anything that greater polymorph allows, the duration is set by the discriptors of type and what not.
06:33:43 <Mekkis> It's a way of bypassing obstacles, a save-or-die, and a long-duration buff.
06:34:07 <steven> It is a very powerful and flexible spell.
06:34:08 <Ballig> sometimes it's possible to let a spell become /too/ powerful based on that single higher spell level
06:34:13 <Mekkis> Definitely worth being eighth-level
06:34:37 <Mekkis> but I was pretty sure it didn't let you got and turn things into CR25 monsters
06:35:06 <Ballig> I would say the link to greater polymorph in the first sentence is definitely intentional and designed to prevent that
06:35:15 <steven> one would hope so.
06:35:29 <steven> last thing we need is another magic bane bandersnatch thread.
06:35:41 <Mekkis> yeah. That was BS
06:36:04 <steven> Ahtuz uses his prepared casting of PAO to change a melee character into a dragon for the module.
06:36:21 <Mekkis> Ahtuz is your necromancer?
06:36:26 <steven> yup
06:36:56 <steven> nothing like giving a melee character... specially a barbarian, several additional attacks.
06:37:12 <Mekkis> Itzamna is considering getting a scroll of it - to use with his mnemonic vestments
06:37:44 <steven> and its a really stupid combination if the barbarian is a natural attack barbarian.
06:38:21 <Mekkis> At least Pathfinder got rid of the Alter Self loophole
06:38:30 <Mekkis> or it would be even worse
06:40:07 <steven> nah, they are both polymorph spells, so they dont stack.
06:40:46 <Mekkis> (that's not the Alter Self loophole)
06:40:58 <steven> oh yeah, that was just stupid
06:41:18 <Mekkis> Still works with Disguise Self
06:41:27 <steven> but hey, people will go for any bonuses they can get.
06:42:18 <Mekkis> Alter Self loophole: You assume the form of a creature of the same type as your normal form. The new form must be within one size category of your normal size.
06:42:59 <Mekkis> (3.5e polymorph is based on Alter Self, so if you're an outsider, you suddenly get a lot of choice)
06:47:15 <Ballig> 3.5e didn't anticipate all the splat books giving so much choice
06:47:17 <Ballig> it killed it
06:48:29 <Mekkis> You could argue that neither did Pathfinder
06:48:36 <Ballig> it's definitely getting to that point
06:48:42 <Ballig> I say "killed it", but that's too harsh
06:48:49 <Ballig> you just have to be fastidious about limiting it
06:48:52 <Mekkis> (Pathfinder has more base classes than 3.5 now)
06:49:02 <Mekkis> Have you looked at 5e?
06:49:12 <Ballig> I haven't
06:49:13 <steven> i've played it.
06:49:25 <steven> meh
06:49:30 <Ballig> I heard they didn't continue with the 4e path
06:49:43 <steven> Been playing Starwars Edge of the Empire
06:49:59 <Mekkis> I like it, to be honest. The rules are good at getting out of the way.
06:49:59 <steven> lots of fun.
06:50:23 <Mekkis> It's also interesting in that it's been over a year, and Wizards has released only one splatbook.
06:50:51 <steven> the rules are also good at empowering...
06:51:07 <steven> 100hp character at 3rd level
06:51:43 <Mekkis> in 5e? seriously?
06:52:10 <steven> yuuuuuuuuuuup
06:52:27 <Mekkis> Why?
06:52:45 <Mekkis> and how? I'm guessing it has something to do with druid.
06:52:50 <Ballig> is that within the scope of the challenge?
06:52:53 <steven> yeah druid stuff
06:53:15 <Ballig> or are you level 3 with 100hp while everyone else at level 3 has 15-20?
06:53:32 <Mekkis> Actually one of my concerns with 5e is that it is pretty difficult to die anyway. So having 100hp doesn't make much difference.
06:53:55 <steven> there is also the immortal druid build i saw
06:54:19 <Ballig> it's a bit sad that 5e isn't that old and these things are already possible, but sometimes as a GM you just have to say "no"
06:54:20 <Mekkis> This is theorycraft, right?
06:56:34 <steven> its a legit problem in the 5e community.
06:58:29 <Mekkis> oh, people bring them to the table and say "You have to let me play this"?
07:00:45 <Ballig> I can only see it being a problem in organised play if it's not disallowed by the organisation rules
07:06:04 <Mekkis> steven, can I unchain my first world summoner?
07:06:24 <steven> heell if i know
07:06:32 <steven> i dont play summoners and so arent familiar with them
07:06:42 <steven> and yeah its mostly in organized play
07:07:38 <Mekkis> I don't do 5e organised play
07:08:10 <Mekkis> that being said, Ballig, if you're interested in some 5e, my Wednesday evening group has a free slot
07:17:34 <Ballig> I like the analogy, but linking it with "I hate Lord of the Rings [because it is analogous to this real world hypothetical situation]" is a stretch that detracts from the humour a bit
07:53:11 <Mekkis> perhaps
07:55:00 <Mekkis> (although the situation isn't particularly hypothetical)
08:06:36 <Mekkis> How are things going, Ballig?
08:08:07 <Mekkis> !hp 8d10m2
08:08:08 <diebot> Mekkis, 68
08:09:13 <Mekkis> Hmmm... Should my 8th level advancement for my swashbuckler go to dex (bringing it up to 23) or int (bringing it up to 14)?
08:39:08 <Mekkis> Sounds like Magic
08:55:24 <Mekkis> So if one of my players wanted to polymorph a pseudodragon familiar into an ancient gold dragon, what would the stats for the dragon be?
09:15:18 <Brunius`> dex
10:04:49 <Avatar> I'm at the point with organised play where I'd like to play the scenarios but going by their rules and reporting is a bit completely pointless
10:05:16 <Ballig> I got frustrated with how long it would take them to rule on something that's clearly broken, if they ever did
10:05:25 <Avatar> exactly
10:05:39 <Avatar> and having to adhere to the shitty rulings that plenty of people didn't like
10:05:53 <Ballig> there's also the inherent lack of real continuity which is a bit disappointing but difficult to avoid in organised play
10:06:45 <Avatar> I think that's just a thing with playing in scenarios
10:06:57 <Avatar> I don't think you could avoid that a lot playing with the same group either
10:07:03 <Ballig> well, specifically it's a thing with playing in a system where anyone can GM and anyone can pick up and play
10:07:20 <Ballig> it's designed to get games going effeciently, but it means you can't really play a bunch with the same party under the same GM that easily
10:07:41 <Ballig> so you have to contrive some sort of roleplay or relationship between characters in the party you happen to be in today
10:08:28 <Ballig> I had hoped that those adventure paths/longer campaigns would be a way to go, but we had such an issue getting people to commit to them
10:12:48 <Avatar> yeah but I've played games with the same people and not a whole lot more roleplay came out of it
10:12:56 <Avatar> not in the same way as our old campaigns did
10:13:05 <Avatar> eyes of the ten is an easy example
10:13:14 <aidrocsid> well mekkis clearly you have artistic ability
10:13:32 <Ballig> I think a big part of that is just because people adapted their playstyle for the scenarios, and don't really take the opportunity to let loose even when playing with the same group for a while
10:13:33 <aidrocsid> did you paint those or what?
10:14:03 <Ballig> kind of like the difference between partying with a group of your friends in DDO compared to pugging it with some randoms
10:14:03 <Avatar> the discussions you have are based more on the problem at hand rather than what a jerk someone is
10:14:31 <Ballig> in a normal campaign, you can spend a whole session discussing what a jerk someone is
10:14:36 <Ballig> because there aren't any limits
10:15:17 <aidrocsid> was that a pun
11:51:57 <mib_2rpyzj> E
12:22:58 <Brunius`> E
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14:59:42 <steven> "Lets leave town at about 10am"
14:59:57 * steven is ready at 830am
15:00:45 * steven is still sitting at his house at 10:30am
15:22:36 <steven> Called the guy.
15:22:50 <steven> he is having breakfast with a friend.
15:23:02 <steven> ...
15:23:19 <steven> guess he didnt want to leave town at 10am
16:34:19 Sriram has quit (Connection closed)
17:54:16 <Mekkis> aidrocsid, no. I have technical ability :P
17:54:49 <Avatar> int
17:55:16 <Avatar> next time just wait till he's there before you're ready
17:55:21 <Avatar> before you get ready
18:46:15 Topic for #d&d is: AEDT (UTC+11:00) || Pathfinder Online http://www.pfrpg.com.au || https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/pathfinder-society-online-collective
18:46:15 Topic for #d&d set by Avatar at Mon Nov 30 19:02:39 2015
18:46:15 <***> Buffer Playback...
18:46:16 <***> Playback Complete.
18:46:58 <Ballig> and make him watch as you get dressed, never breaking eye contact
18:49:47 <Mekkis> Not intentionally
18:50:34 <Ballig> it is a lot like MtG in that regard. skill is absolutely a factor, but deck makeup can more than compensate for skill
18:51:10 <Ballig> now that I know there's a hidden rating system in casual play I threw some games so I could get back to playing against people who are a challenge instead of ones who roll over me
18:51:49 <Ballig> they have a pretty easy way to determine how 'powerful' a deck is because all cards have a rarity associated with them. not sure why that isn't used as part of the matchmaking system
18:52:55 <Ballig> I don't have any decks that are worth more than 600 points. a single legendary card is worth 1600 points, and I have been matched against people who can play multiple legendaries in a row
19:21:27 <Avatar> don't know about that
19:22:11 <Ballig> "Why?!" "You know why. Uh-uh! Don't close your eyes!"
19:32:36 <Zensunni> Hello, all.
19:36:54 <Avatar> sup
19:37:42 <Zensunni> not much, was just looking into making a char
19:41:57 <Mekkis> heh.
19:42:02 <Mekkis> Why not just play Magic?
19:43:07 <Mekkis> What's Brunius` doing up at 3am?
19:44:39 <Avatar> replying to people who come in saying E
19:45:55 <Zensunni> ?
20:50:48 <Ballig> str
20:55:14 <Avatar> honour
20:55:48 <Ballig> for the horde
21:02:51 Ballig has quit (austnet.org!NickOP (Kill requested by Ballig2))
21:02:51 Ballig2 ([email protected]) has joined #d&d
21:02:53 Ballig2 is now known as Ballig
22:14:58 <Avatar> hearthstone > magic
22:45:22 <Mekkis> if you say so
22:50:11 <aidrocsid> you mean you made them in photoshop or you printed them?
22:50:19 <aidrocsid> because photoshop would be artistic ability still
22:50:32 <aidrocsid> but if you printed them either you have a big printer or they're much smaller than the ones i was using
22:50:44 <aidrocsid> btw good thing i made most of it because they ripped through scrapwall super fast
22:50:56 <aidrocsid> not all of it but quite a lot
23:35:19 <steven> yo
23:40:35 <aidrocsid> hey
23:49:09 <steven> how ya doin?
23:50:57 <steven> I just got back from a convention
23:50:58 <aidrocsid> I love gaming paper
23:52:47 <aidrocsid> good, DMed tonight, having some drinks and raving about horace and pete in another channel lol
23:52:51 <aidrocsid> have you seen horace and pete?
23:53:01 <aidrocsid> also about to watch the walking dead
23:57:08 <Mekkis> oh?
23:58:37 <aidrocsid> i just drew every map except the last one from lords of rust
23:58:42 <aidrocsid> and mounted them on cardboard
23:58:51 <aidrocsid> now i don't have to draw at all for the next couple weeks anyway
23:59:24 <aidrocsid> by "just" i mean over the last idk like 6 hours lol
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